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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Bilow who wrote (119896)11/18/2003 12:52:29 PM
From: Sam  Respond to of 281500
 
Re: "There's a damn good reason we have so many American servicemen buried in foreign cemeteries Bilow. It's because we've had a long-standing policy of preferring to defend our allies against totalitarianism instead of waiting for it to directly threaten us."

Great argument...

No, not a "great argument" Carl. We didn't "defend our allies against totalitarianism" in WWII until we were directly attacked. Well, yes, we helped GB with supplies, but certainly not in terms of men. There wasn't public support for it. And it would probably be more accurate to say that the "long standing policy" of the US has been to support totalitarian govts whenever the leadership of that govt agreed to support US business opportunities. Just look at the history of Central and South America from Panama (as it was detached from Columbia) in the 19th C right up through the wars of the 1980s. We supported and defended plenty of brutal totalitarian govts, and it certainly wasn't always due to the Cold War, it predated the Cold War, and included countries which were entirely irrelevant to it. "The business of America is business," said Silent Cal, and that is a fair summary of what has guided US policy over the years from our founding on. The only reason some people don't see just how true that has been, and how expansionist the US has been is that the "rightness" of Manifest Destiny so pervades our collective consciousness that we don't even see the takeover the Western part of this continent as expansion, no matter how many wars, lies and broken treaties with Native American tribes and Mexico it required. And of course it was just six years or so after Turner published his famous paper declaring the Western Frontier "settled" and closed that we turned our sights southward and westward, invading Cuba to get rid of the last vestige of Spanish influence in our neighborhood, and picking up the Philippines as a "bonus." What a "splendid" war that one was (or, I should say, those two, counting the Philippine War).

Of course, it is an outlandish fantasy that we should have allowed any of them to live on the land as they chose. There was gold in them thar hills and they weren't even mining it!



To: Bilow who wrote (119896)11/18/2003 6:41:48 PM
From: Hawkmoon  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 281500
 
The invasion of Iraq didn't solve anything. It made our problem worse. There is no cure.

The hell is didn't.. I don't recall Saudi Arabia offering "squat" to the US prior to that invasion. But they sure are "cooperating" now, aren't they?

Because they know that they could be next, if they don't...

And if anything, it has possibly reopened the possibility of another major source of oil coming onto the market, which would lessen the economic impact of any necessary attack on Saudi Arabia.

And it's so convenient for your to forget that most of the fighting in Iraq is centered on the Sunni communities, not the Kurds and Shiites who make up some 80% of the Iraqi population.

Hawk



To: Bilow who wrote (119896)11/19/2003 10:31:08 PM
From: Jdaasoc  Respond to of 281500
 
It is clear our time in Iraq is limited. Brenner is architect of arming Iraqis to fight our enemy Iran in early 80's.

We are just about ready to arm and turn over country to Chalibi. He seems very well suited to be the leader of our right wing killers that we have hired in Nicaragua, Chile or several Africa republics in the past. We will just hand over all the military equipment that still is not blown up there and fly out out of Baghdad before going gets too dangerous.