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Politics : Piffer Thread on Political Rantings and Ravings -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: zonder who wrote (12187)	1/19/2004 2:36:30 PM
From: X Y Zebra	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 14610

what exactly is "Libertarian"? A belief based on the Laissez Faire ideology, where the freedom to do as one pleases under the clout of individual rights (including right to own property) is central. This freedom should NEVER infringe upon the rights OF OTHERS. Btw, they used to call it "Liberalism", until this term (Liberalism) became synonymous with 'excessive government', 'democrat', 'big spender’ "Clinton-Lover" -gg etc. Responsibility for one's action is also central (and probably the largest reason why it will NEVER succeed), you see... in most other systems or beliefs... there is always the scapegoats to blame, (and the attorneys to ensure they can be sued)... (see my next post for the pathetic result of excessive rules, government actions, paternalistic attitudes... and in general, the continued procreation of idiots and morons) Meanwhile, back at the ranch.... It is where the individual is the focus of one's own freedom; to be capable to provide for most of his/her needs by his/her own effort. Under such, the government should only participate in the following functions: 1. Protection of the country against foreign enemies (army) 2. Arbiter of disputes arising from the laws of the community (judicial system) 3. Enforcer of the laws established and protector of the community from domestic enemies (police) All this assumes that the individual is ethical, and educated; he/she needs no guidance from politicians and/or bureaucrats as to how to live her or his life. Of course... (And unfortunately), we know reality is different. Worse, we know that the majority are not really seeking to be free (what they want is to be secure), or are they willing to work or take the risk that it takes to be self sufficient. The problem gets worse, when you have a party (The Libertarian party) who has not been able to come up with someone bright enough to even make an impression on the system)... inherently... I believe that the mentality of a libertarian does not allow him or her to be a leader... it is almost an oxymoron.... since it is the individual himself/herself who is supposed to be doing the leading... But you have to make your own opinion... if you are interested... here are a few places to inform yourself: theihs.org According to Charles Murray, What It Means to Be a Libertarian, Broadway Books, 1997 The American Founders created a society based on the belief that human happiness is intimately connected with personal freedom and responsibility. The twin pillars of the system they created were limits on the power of the central government and protection of individual rights. . . . A few people, of whom I am one, think that the Founders' insights are as true today as they were two centuries ago. We believe that human happiness requires freedom and that freedom requires limited government. The correct word for my view of the world is liberal. "Liberal" is the simplest Anglicization of the Latin liber, and freedom is what classical liberalism is all about. The writers of the nineteenth century who expounded on this view were called liberals. In Continental Europe they still are. . . . But words mean what people think they mean, and in the United States the unmodified term liberal now refers to the politics of an expansive government and the welfare state. The contemporary alternative is libertarian. . . . Libertarianism is a vision of how people should be able to live their lives-as individuals, striving to realize the best they have within them; together, cooperating for the common good without compulsion. It is a vision of how people may endow their lives with meaning-living according to their deepest beliefs and taking responsibility for the consequences of their actions. Take a test: politopia.com politopia.com The Libertarian Party web site: lp.org Other places of interest in this reference: aynrand.org "America's founding ideal was the principle of individual rights. Nothing more and nothing less. The rest --everything that America achieved, everything she became, everything "noble" and "just", and heroic, and great, and unprecedented in human history-- was the logical consequence of fidelity to that one principle. The first consequence was the principle of political freedom, i.e. an individual's freedom from physical compulsion, coercion, or interference by the government. The next was the implementation of political freedom: The system of Capitalism." ["A preview" Ayn Rand Letters] _________ "If you ask me to name the proudest distinction of Americans, I would choose...the fact that they were the people who created the phrase 'to make money'. No other language or nation had ever used these words before...Americans were the first to understand that wealth has to be created. " ~ Francisco D'Anconia from Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged, 1957 ___________ Objectiivism (the phylosophy of Ayn Rand) aynrand.org

To: zonder who wrote (12187)	1/19/2004 3:39:40 PM
From: Lazarus_Long	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 14610

Such as - Neither Dem nor Rep argues for a more social state. Neither are Green. Neither are racist/fascist. I agree there are no lack of nuts in the world cake. So are you recommending we elect a Baathist? Saddam really was a nice guy, right? Green? The US has a Green Party. Nader ran as a Green. racist/fascist Oh, we've had no lack of racists. Remember Martin Luther King? He had a problem with them. Today is a federal holiday over here- -his birthday. Strom Thurmond split from the Dem Party and ran as a Dixiecrat. He was a racial segregationist. There was a Nazi Party in the US prior to WW1. There are several Neonazi parties still loose. Gee, maybe Americans prefer sanity. You Europeans may do as you wish. And have. The Nazis, Fascists, and Communists ARE European, remember? Just don't do it to us. That will get your *** kicked. vast spectrum of the world's political parties You are truly welcome to your "vast spectrum". We may have had slavery and racial segregation here, but we corrected both. And we never had Auschwitz. what exactly is "Libertarian"? I think XYZ did an excellent job on that. My preferred choice if they could ever get their act together and actually put up someone who could win.