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Politics : Politics for Pros- moderated -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Ilaine who wrote (35964)3/21/2004 9:23:28 PM
From: LindyBill  Read Replies (3) | Respond to of 793707
 
Good rebuttal of the "60 minutes" interview by "Ranting Profs."


RICHARD CLARKE: THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM
By Cori Dauber

Well, that Richard Clarke story left me with more questions than answers. It certainly was incendiary, and if the point was to make it look as if the President and his team was virtually negligent on the issue of terrorism, almost brought September 11th on, then Clarke, with 60 Minutes collusion, succeeded.

But so much of what he said just didn't quite jive with what's already in the public record. For example, he complains that he asked for a Cabinet level meeting within days of the Inaugural and didn't get it until September 4th. But we know that it was between the 4th and the 10th that a complete plan for dealing with al Queda was finalized for the President's signature. So it may be that he wasn't given a meeting -- but clearly somebody was having meetings on the question of terrorism.

He says that the FBI knew that two members of the hijacking teams were in the country in July. It may be that the CIA knew in July, but they didn't tell the FBI until two weeks before the attack, which set off a frantic search. That's been one of the key indictments of the way the two agencies worked (or didn't, as the case may be) together prior to September 11th.

Most bizarrely (and this brings me to the elephant in the room, which I'll explain in a bit) he asserts that intelligence "chatter" prior to New Year's, 1999 put the Clinton team on "battle stations," which is how the plot to bomb LAX was broken. That is patently absurd. It was the combination of a very alert, very good Border Patrol Agent on the Canadian border and a very nervous, very incompetent would-be terrorist. When she didn't like his looks, his nervousness, his general demeanour and started questioning him aggressively he broke and ran for it. And that point they grabbed him, searched his car and found the explosives in it.

The elephant in the room? Dick Clarke was Clinton's "terrorism czar." He goes on and on and on about how he warned the Bushies that al Queda was an urgent threat, but they didn't do enough. Why doesn't Leslie Stahl, if she's such a tough, good interviewer, ever ask him what he thinks about the Clinton team's record? Why was the cancer of al Queda allowed to grow under Clarke's watch? Now, you could say, and not unreasonably, that Bush's performance is relevant, urgently so, while Clinton's isn't, because Clinton isn't running for anything. True. Except that Clinton's record on terrorism is essentially Dick Clarke's record on terrorism. And his credibility on this question is partly his expertise and partly this notion that he was a voice crying in the wilderness.

If his charges against this President are to be taken as credible, and not partisan, then we need to know where that voice was for the previous eight years.

Too bad CBS couldn't see past the sizzle of a provocative interview to help us out with that information. They make a pass at it by asking him straight up whether he's shilling for Kerry, since he's apparently teaching with one of Kerry's foreign policy advisors. But I think my question gets at the issue in a more useful way then simply asking the man, "hey, are you doing this because you're a hack?"

He's obviously filled with rage. Is it rage because the issue was ignored? Or because he was shut out of the loop as the plan for dealing with al Queda moved forward?

I'll tell you after I've read the book. But this one sided interview, designed to be as incendiary as possible, not to get at the truth, doesn't answer any questions, it raises them.



To: Ilaine who wrote (35964)3/21/2004 9:39:21 PM
From: LindyBill  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 793707
 
Some comments from some bloggers who were there.

LGF....There was actually a good mix of us there. Not everyone was from protest warrior, in fact only about 5-10 of us were. There were a few guys from freerepublic.org and some others who were there independently. A mother, and Protest Warrior reg (name escapes me now, sorry!) brought her two little daughters who chose to be with mom at this event rather than a birthday party. They were in the 8-10yo age range and one held a sign I liked: "we don't strap explosives to our 10 year olds." Another man had a sign with the waffle house logo and showed J. Kerry "flipping" on the issues . Most notably among us, there was a very intelligent, very dignified, Iraqi-American man, who it was a pure honor to meet. Even after you've seen protest warriors wage their arguments on the left, you haven't seen nothing compared to this guy. He systematically tore every argument up that the freedom haters confronted him with. I thoroughly enjoyed being in his company and just observing his debates. I met a lot of great people today.

Of course, with the great people, come the not-so-great people. Yes, you guessed it, the freedom haters. The turnout at this rally was meager. I'd say there was no more than 500 people total. Nevertheless, the police were there in force. Whenever a confrontation would get out of hand they would step in and quiet people down. The funny thing is, you could tell that they were clearly on our side and they didn't care when people complained that we didn't have a permit and laughed with us and were very agreeable. And I'm proud to say thay unlike the freedom-haters, we were very respectful throughout the event. Every once in awhile, someone would emerge from the opposing crowd and begin yelling profanities at us at the top of their lungs... you know the standard ones (ie fascists, racists, imperialists, idiots, f***ers) or a combination of them. At one point a man came out yelling at us and the Iraqi-American guy got the most upset and started yelling back in Arabic. We learned later from the Iraqi-American that the guy was a Palestinian who supported Yasar Arafat and suicide bombings in Israel - yeah, disgusting. The most astounding thing I think to us and to the Iraqi-American was that they were flying the Baathist Party flags (of course not one American flag in their whole assembly).

The freedom haters made their speeches, sang their songs, chanted, yelled and did what freedom-haters do. Of course there was a lot of anti-Bush rhetoric, you know, the whole schpeel. They were composed of a number of different groups, of course ANSWER was there in force (more than I expected) too. The media was present also. I think we actually got more attention than did the war protestors. I wish they hadn't have interviewed some of the people that they did, but its nothing I can stop now. The media will spin this whatever way they can especially CBS (the local affiliate present) and our local paper, the AJC.

Overall, this was a rewarding event. I learned something today, above all else: the power of free speech. Its a power you don't know you have or to what extent you have it until you use it. I think that those who haven't attended a rally of this type, cannot comprehend or appreciate the liberating power of free speech. And when you carry our message, you realize you don't need a megaphone or a thousand people or massive demonstration. The message is its own weapon, and for that, I'm proud to be a part of protest warriors.

HOOTINAN - Crashing The Protest
I don’t post much on weekends, but no matter where I am, I usually try to slip in a post or two. But today was a little different. I’ve been gone all day and if you were to guess that I went to the moronic convergence in New York City (also known as the "anti-war" protest), you’d be right. I went. But not with International A.N.S.W.E.R.’s raving moonbat mob of anti-American, anti-Israel and anti-Semitic degenerates, I went as a Protest Warrior and walked around with delightfully humorous and intelligent signs that flew in the face of much of what the "anti-war" movement claimed to stand for. And man was it fun to see the looks on those idiots face’s when they saw our signs, the looks of amazement were funny as hell but which quickly turned into hate and anger once they realized we weren’t on their side. The peace and love crowd was anything but. Sitting here I can’t even count how many times we were accused of being cia-ops, on the Bush/Cheney payroll, on Halliburton’s payroll, called fascists, racist, bigots, anti-gay (even though we didn’t have any signs that even touched on any gay rights issues), anti-Muslim, anti-women...shoved, pushed around and told to die, to "fuck off whitey" and the list goes on and on (told you I couldn’t count ’em all). At one point we encountered a massive wall of idiots (I think they were catching on to us so one of them radioed ahead to their comrades to watch out for us), where some were adorned with the symbol of Palestinian terrorism, the kaffiyeh and after bemoaning that we were anti-everything under the sun, they began chanting long live the intifadah!, long live the intifadah!, long live the intifadah!!! with blood in their eyes and sheer violence in their voice. It was truly scary. If the police weren’t there to hold back these nuts, it could have turned ugly, and fast. That was about the worst of the lunacy though, thank God. After that the protest died down, we did some interviews, were told to eff off a few more times and that was that. I unfortunately didn’t get the chance (nor did my batteries afford me the chance) to take many pictures but Ivan did for anti-com.com, go check ’em out. I also got to meet the lovely, Judith Weiss from Kesher Talk. Go check out her take on the today’s events. She and I tried endlessly to get online after the march because we were both itching to blog about the day’s events but had no such luck. Anyways, it was an awesome time, execpt for the death threats and whatnot, I got to meet a ton of really nice, friendly, and genuine people and I can’t wait to stick it to the Left again at the next protest!



To: Ilaine who wrote (35964)3/21/2004 10:20:41 PM
From: gamesmistress  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 793707
 
CB, if your sons didn't go for fear of violence, it was just as well. Here's a report from a counter-protester in NYC, from (if I remember right, one of your favorites) Allah is in the House:

Allah reader "Babs" e-mails with a report from yesterday's "peace" march in New York City.

Well, it was a tough day of counter protesting but we made it through with hardly a scratch! Some of the peace marchers tended toward violence and they did not like it one little bit that we crashed their whacked out party. Unfortunately, some in our group were attacked, actually a couple of times. I didn't know that peace marchers would think to "put a bullet in your head", but I guess that's how uninformed I am about peace. If I didn't think I might get stomped to death I would have suggested that the peace marcher join the Army! They need guys that want to put bullets in people's heads.

At one point things got really pretty dicey as one of my fellow protest warriors was being choked right there in the middle of the street and the NYPD came in and rescued us! They corralled us into a bull pen sort of place and protected us from the peace marchers... Then, they assigned a scooter brigade to guard us while we expressed our right of free speech. My poor sainted husband, who I talked into coming with me was being shoved and screamed at by the ANSWER security squad (brown shirts) and he remarked that we have free speech in the U.S. to which the goon screamed in return "there is no fuckin free speech". I think this would come as a surprise to the thousands of police officers that were assigned to this march in order for people to exercise their right to assembly and free speech. But then, maybe we are just confused.

While in the police bullpen one of the big wig officers came up to me and said under his breath "I can't say this in public but we love you guys, we wish you would turn out more often". I told him the problem was that we have jobs and therefore our time is somewhat limited.
Keep an eye on the Protest Warrior website for forthcoming photos and video.

UPDATE: Babs e-mails with more details from the march, including this exchange with an exceptionally stupid peacenik.

I was carrying the sign that said "Liberating Iraqi Children from Tyranny, It's Co$ting Too Much". The sign has a picture of three Iraqi girls on it. One of the peace marchers came up to me and asked me what my sign meant.
Me: Well, think about it a bit
Him: I have thought about it and I don't understand it
Me: I am a feminist and I have a wish for the Iraqi girls in this photo. You support feminism, don't you?
Him: Yes, absolutely
Me: Well yes, of course, my wish is that these girls have the freedom to be educated. You wish that all women on earth have the freedom to be educated, don't you?
Him: Oh yes
Me: I also wish for these girls that they be given the power to control their lives. You support the notion of women being able to control their own lives, don't you?
Him: Yes!
Me: I wish for these girls to become doctors or teachers or whatever it is that they want to do. You support that don't you?
Him: Yes
Me: Well, that is what my sign is about
He seemed to go away happy!