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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Bilow who wrote (128753)	4/8/2004 10:23:44 PM
From: NightOwl	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

You do realize you can't win this argument with a nihilist don't you Carl? <Hoo><Hoo> *(a) We own the night in the country. Cities have no night. There are either lights, or stuff on fire.* Stuff on fire? Great! Get the Cobras and Warthogs back in the game. See something moving in the "light" - blast it. (b) Our armor is improved, but so are the anti armor weapons in the hands of the other side. For that matter, armor is famous for being vulnerable in cities. The main problem is that cities tend to channel military forces into predictable lanes of movement, and the enemy will set up ambushes (IEDs or antitank weapons or whatever) for those lanes. Let's see "no armor" vs. "improved armor"... I'll go with the improved armor and take my chances. (c) Our medical is also improved, but we're still taking the casualties and taking them big time. In addition, a lot of our guys are getting seriously wounded and are not going back. My argument was based on simple kill ratios, and since the kill ratios have not turned extremely high in our favor, the historical kill ratios are correct. By your argument, the government's reports of 47 soldiers dead in Iraq in 8 days must be in error. You want extremely high kill ratio's? Boy do I have your extremely high kill ratio's! How many Fallujahians do you want taken out? Re: "Moreover, I figure this enemy will not be able to sustain 800,000 KIA, much less a million before caving." How many Iraqis do you know? Not the white meat type living in the US, but the ones who stayed in the old country? How many raptors do you know? ...Not the lily livered FRAMeaters at the INN, but the ones that eat the meat while its still kicking? Carl I frankly don't know what to tell you. I'm trying to be optimistic here. But if you say its going to take a million, two million or eight... well so be it. I'm am really thrilled with your your assurances that Chicago is likely to remain generally radiation free. But I have to tell you CB, I frankly do not care to live under that or any other threat from these suicidal idiots. If eliminating the entire world of Iraqi's - white meat or dark - will give me freedom from such concerns, I would have no compulsions whatever at pulling the trigger on them. Give them 48 hours to get their act straight if you want, but to embark on a "20 year" occupation of their nuthouse, when you know you can stop it all in a month doesn't compute in my mathmatology. 0\|0

To: Bilow who wrote (128753)	4/9/2004 5:17:25 AM
From: NightOwl	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

News reports a "cessation of offensive operations" in Fallujah. Not a cease fire. The Marines will defend their positions, but at least someone says they want to talk. ...So is it a trap or will it require a lot less KIA's than 800,000? :) 0\|0

To: Bilow who wrote (128753)	4/9/2004 8:03:44 AM
From: Bill Ulrich	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Two-thirds of the post-'victory' attacks have been in the Sunni Triangle. Sunni Triangle is about 2% of the 25,000,000. In this discussion of "The 5-Percent" solution, I question whether the aggregate population of 25,000,000 is the appropriate one. What about a "10%+ Solution" of the Sunni Triangle, instead? That's about 50,000 and a real good start for that area that is causing a disproportionate amount of trouble. Shiite's have only recently been a real problem and even then, only a small minority. The Kurds (about 15% of the 25mil) are happy campers anyway. Seems like the base consideration of 25,000,000 oughta be reduced to better reflect who's really trying to kill us and who isn't even considering it. "That's about 50,000 Iraqis. Out of a population of 25 million, that's about 1 in 500."

To: Bilow who wrote (128753)	12/24/2004 8:22:39 PM
From: TimF	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

You used a figure of less than 5000 US combat deaths. Assume a very optimistic kill ratio of 10 to 1. That's about 50,000 Iraqis. Out of a population of 25 million, that's about 1 in 500. Now scale that down to the much smaller problem in Palestine. There are something like 3 million Palestinians. One in 500 is about 6,000. The number of Palestinians already killed in the (very mild) scrabble with Israel is considerably higher than that (over the past 60 years), but still they keep on fighting The percentage of Palestinians that are actively against Israel is much greater then the percentages of Iraqis that are actively against the US. In terms of passive opposition pretty much all the Palestinians are against Israel while it is likely that at least many of the Shia will support the new government after the elections. All of which doesn't mean things will be easy in Iraq, I m just pointing out that comparing the population of Iraq and Palestine isn't something that will be very useful in determing how difficult Iraq will be for here. Tim