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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jacob Snyder who wrote (134932)	5/30/2004 9:43:20 AM
From: jttmab	Respond to of 281500

Among the sayings and discourses imputed to him [Jesus] by his biographers, I find many passages of fine imagination, correct morality, and of the most lovely benevolence; and others again of so much ignorance, so much absurdity, so much untruth, charlatanism, and imposture, as to pronounce it impossible that such contradictions should have proceeded from the same being. -Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Short, April 13, 1820

To: Jacob Snyder who wrote (134932)	5/30/2004 11:33:50 PM
From: unclewest	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Which God would bless our troops? Hi Jacob, I fear I will not be as eloquent as you pursuing this line of thinking...Though I do think it is an important subject. This is the second time you asked me about God and war and soldiers. Let me first assure you that I hate war. I have been there and done that and fully comprehend the ugliness of it all. That does not mean however that I think wars cannot be just and appropriate. I did like your comment about individual responsibility. I too think that is important. The point you missed is that a few bad apples perpetrating an inappropriate behavior does not mean the entire effort is unjust. It means they as individuals were wrong. We all, as you indicated, have to decide if the current effort is just. Ending a war because of conviction is acceptable. Ending a war because we are tired of it or it is too costly is not. If the goal of war is to find peace, as I think, ending it for the latter reasons and before finding peace only creates more chaos and conflict. The big question is if we end this war right now, who will have peace? There is another element to all of this called sacrifice. Americans understood this concept well at one time. Certainly those storming the beaches at Normandy and elsewhere did. In hindsight, we look at photos of Auschwitz, then at photos of dead American soldiers on the beaches and it makes sense. But we should remember that those men did not have the Auschwitz photos to motivate them. The pictures came later. That brings me to the thought that many Americans today, before sacrificing aka contributing, want to know what is in it for them. There must be a quid pro quo for these folks. It permeates every aspect of their lives. If they pay taxes, they want something for it on a personal level. If they donate at church, they want to know how the church is going to spend the money to benefit their kids. The idea of sacrificing for the greater good is being lost. As you suggested in a more recent post, Many Americans motivation is a mile wide and an inch deep. Now to your question. The God I wrote about is the most majestic and the most caring. Many know His name, though they are often reluctant to let it roll off their lips. His promise is not one of less sacrifice as many wish. His promise is a share of the greatest glory if the effort is just. I believe our opponents oft stated commitment to, "Kill all Jews, kill all Christians and kill all Americans" is the embodiment of evil. If I am right, the compelling question now becomes what is the source of this evil? I believe the answer to that can be found in the scriptures you so handily quote. We do not all have to agree about these issues. We all do, however, have to make a decision. We each have three choices. We can stand by and do nothing or we can choose a side and support it. The latter two require sacrifice. They also require a judgement. If you are inclined to avoid conflict at all cost, then imo you have taken a position that all cost and sacrifice is too much for the greater good of mankind. If you are inclined to believe that, in fact, there is evil on earth and it is worth fighting against it, you then must choose sides. No one person, not even the geniuses on SI, can do it all alone. Each of us can make but a small contribution to the total effort. Likewise, no one person can see and know everything about what is going on. Participating in war requires a leap of faith that your personal effort is properly orientated and that any sacrifice you have to make is worth the effort. Those of us who believe in this God also believe that He will again lead us to triumph over evil and that our sacrifice will eventually bring us to greater glory whether we survive the combat or not. One final comment. You mentioned Boykin. I know Jerry Boykin. I had several one on one conversations with him last year and expect to see him again in three weeks. Our discussion was never about God or combat, it was about refugees and how best to assist them. Boykin has addressed the issues I have outlined here. He has not chosen to stand idly by and do nothing. He has chosen sides. He has decided that fighting the evil he perceives is more important than any sacrifice he personally may be called upon to make. I do not mind you taking an opposing viewpoint... But I would ask that you recognize that he is a man of character and integrity. Boykin speaks from the heart. He means what he says, says what he means and is willing to die for his beliefs and convictions. We used to have an entire country full of men like that. unclewest