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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (210219)11/2/2004 5:38:06 PM
From: tejek  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 1578015
 
And second, there is no equivalent of the Pope in any Protestant church that I know of. In fact, that would be contradictory to the foundations of Protestantism, wouldn't you agree? Maybe there are administrative heads, selected with the help of prayer and due process, but that's as far as it goes.

I said Pope because I didn't know what the head of the S. Baptist church is called. I will try and find the article that discussed the issue. No guarantees.

ted



To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (210219)11/2/2004 5:41:16 PM
From: tejek  Respond to of 1578015
 
presidentialprayerteam.org



To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (210219)11/2/2004 5:53:01 PM
From: tejek  Respond to of 1578015
 
I was looking for that article re. making Bush some kind of S. Baptist head when I found this interesting article on a website called Christianity Today. Apparently, the relationship between Bush and at least some Evangelicals is not as warm as I thought. I am glad to hear that they too believe in the separation of church and state.

*****************************************************

Bush Wants Church Support

Campaign organizers for President Bush have sent a document to churches, asking for supporters to complete specific "duties" on behalf of the campaign. It isn't the campaign's first appeal to churchgoers, but this time, even evangelicals are questioning the tactics.

According to The Washington Post, supporters' duties include:

By July 31, for example, volunteers are to "send your Church Directory to your State Bush-Cheney '04 Headquarters or give [it] to a BC04 Field Rep" and "Talk to your Pastor about holding a Citizenship Sunday and Voter Registration Drive."
By Aug. 15, they are to "talk to your Church's seniors or 20-30 something group about Bush/Cheney '04" and "recruit 5 more people in your church to volunteer for the Bush Cheney campaign."

By Sept. 17, they are to host at least two campaign-related potluck dinners with church members, and in October they are to "finish calling all Pro-Bush members of your church," "finish distributing Voter Guides in your church" and place notices on church bulletin boards or in Sunday programs "about all Christian citizens needing to vote."
The potential alliance is drawing the ire of groups advocating the separation of church and state. According to Reuters, Americans United for Separation of Church and State said, "Any coordination between the Bush campaign and church leaders would clearly be illegal." The Washington Post, who actually contacted the IRS to see if the activities would cause a church to lose its tax-exempt status, wrote that the IRS warned, "a preference for or against a certain candidate or party … becomes a prohibited activity."

This story has been ongoing for some time now. Last month, Oregon pastors asked churchgoers to sign a petition asking for an amendment banning same-sex marriage. "The campaign … has raised questions about how far churches can go to promote ballot measures without jeopardizing their tax-exempt status, which carries some limits on political activity," wrote The Oregonian. Also last month, the Bush campaign sent out a letter seeking to identify 1,600 "friendly congregations" in Pennsylvania.

In both instances, and in others, the cries of the Bush opposition camps warning about the separation of church and state and tax-exemption were loud. This time, however, even Bush-friendly evangelicals are resisting the campaign's outreach. According to Reuters, Richard Land said he was "appalled."

"First of all, I would not want my church directories being used that way,'' he told Reuters in an interview, predicting failure for the Bush plan.

The conservative [Southern Baptist] Protestant denomination, whose 16 million members strongly backed Bush in 2000, held regular drives that encouraged church-goers to "vote their values,'' said Land.

"But it's one thing for us to do that. It's a totally different thing for a partisan campaign to come in and try to organize a church. A lot of pastors are going to say: 'Wait a minute, bub','' he added.

New York Times's David D. Kirkpatrick, writes:

Richard J. Mouw, president of the Fuller Theological Seminary in Pasadena, Calif., one of the largest evangelical Protestant seminaries, said: "Theologically speaking, churches are really in a position to speak truth to power. But this smacks of too close an alliance of church and Caesar."

Mr. Mouw added that the Bush campaign should not take evangelical votes for granted.

"I find," he said, "that a lot of church people, including a lot of evangelicals, are increasingly nervous about the credibility of the Bush administration on issues that a year or two ago people were ready to trust them on, like foreign policy.

"Rather than just assuming that evangelical churches are ready to hand over their membership lists, they would do much better to spend some time trying to convince us that they really do have the interests of biblical Christians at heart."
Interestingly, even Bush supporters are questioning whether the administration is taking their views seriously enough. Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council, wrote in a recent Washington Update email,

continued...........

christianitytoday.com



To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (210219)11/2/2004 5:56:58 PM
From: tejek  Respond to of 1578015
 
SOUTHERN BAPTISTS CHEER BUSH - SECEDE

rumormillnews.com

Ten, it was around this time when the S. Baptists split from the Baptist Alliance but there was no mention in this article.



To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (210219)11/2/2004 6:02:21 PM
From: tejek  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 1578015
 
This was the 3rd year in a row Bush spoke at the S. Baptist's annual meeting and he's not even Baptist.

In any case, I can't find that reference re. Bush and a position in the church hierchy. Sorry.


**************************************************

Southern Baptists cheer Bush, leave BWA, hear warning about 'separatism'

INDIANAPOLIS (ABP) -- In an eventful first day of their annual meeting, Southern Baptists heard a rousing speech from President George W. Bush, broke ties with the Baptist World Alliance, and elected a new convention president June 15.

During the meeting that marked the 25th anniversary of the Southern Baptist Convention's historic conservative swing, messengers heard a warning from their top official that the conservative movement is in danger of going too far to the right. "We cannot let this convention be driven by politics," said Morris Chapman, president of the SBC Executive Committee, who warned of "lifeless orthodoxy parading as true faith."

President Bush supplied the emotional climax for the convention's first day, addressing messengers live via satellite.

When SBC President Jack Graham of Dallas introduced Bush, messengers greeted him with uproarious applause. Bush thanked the messengers five times, chuckling toward the end, before their greeting died down so that he could begin his speech. Then, once he started his 12-minute speech, they interrupted him more than 20 times with applause, sometimes punctuated by cheers and whistles.


The president emphasized themes that resonated with the convention's conservative core -- the battle against terrorism and the struggle to bring democracy to the Middle East, his record on tax cuts and job creation, as well as education and Medicare. He called on the U.S. Senate to allow him to appoint conservative judges and on Congress to pass laws supporting government funding for faith-based initiatives.

Bush generated the strongest response as he emphasized moral issues.

"I will keep working to build a culture of life in America," he pledged, citing his support for three anti-abortion bills, as well as promising more funding for crisis-pregnancy centers, support for adoption as an alternative to abortion, and a law that requires parental notification before a minor girl can have an abortion.

The president vowed to support a ban on human cloning, insisting, "Life is a creation of God."

He stressed his administration would defend "the sanctity of marriage against activist courts and local officials who want to redefine marriage forever," a line that generated sustained applause. "The union of a man and woman is the most enduring human institution honored in all cultures," he added assuring that he would "support a constitutional amendment to protect marriage as the union of a man and a woman."

"These years have brought trials we did not ask for and challenges we did not expect to face," Bush acknowledged. "Now we look forward with confidence and faith. ... We pray always for God's guidance and strength, for our lives and for this great nation."

As expected, messengers voted overwhelmingly to end the denomination's 99-year relationship with the Baptist World Alliance, an international network of Baptist groups. Paige Patterson, speaking for the committee that recommended the break, told messengers some of the 200-plus denominations worldwide that affiliate with BWA "do not believe in the inerrancy and infallibility of Scripture and regularly call it into question."

Denton Lotz, BWA executive director, said afterward, "There are 211 confessions or statements of faith" among BWA's 211 member bodies around the world. "We certainly are not liberal. We're all conservative evangelicals." Lotz said the departure of Southern Baptists was a sad occasion.

As Southern Baptist conservatives marked the 25th anniversary of their rise to power in 1979, Chapman warned the SBC could now "fall into the error of Pharisaism ... lifeless orthodoxy parading as true faith."

continued...............

abpnews.com