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To: Ilaine who wrote (5269)	10/26/2005 11:14:17 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 51721

:-) Is there any intelligent sport? I mean, hitting a little ball around a course in to holes using a knob on the end of a stick? Throwing an elliptical "ball" at each other, and then proceeding to throw yourselves in a pile on the guy with the "ball" (I don't think it's right to call something a ball when it isn't round- talk about stupid). Then there's taking a ball back and forth up and down a court, over and over and over, and throwing it in little baskets. Or how about swimming up and down a pool just to see who swims faster? Talk about stupid. There's usually no point to any games or hobbies (save for the very few hobbies that turn out to be moneymakers), imo. People like group activities, and the relative intelligence of the activity is hard to measure, since almost all of these things look pretty stupid if you aren't in to it. IMO, of course.

To: Ilaine who wrote (5269)	10/26/2005 12:41:58 PM
From: Rambi	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 51721

Would I buy it? No, of course not. But I dislike the labelling of things as STUPID. There are a lot of things I could either be insulting about or I could just say that personally, I would never engage in them. Buying tiny containers of wrinkle lotion for 250 or 350 dollar purses. Fur coats, autographed basketballs, jaguars, grand pianos that no one ever plays, a dog that costs 600 like some friends of ours just bought. I can think of so many things that I would never spend money on, but others find rewarding in some way. I doubt I will watch another Nascar race, but what I DID do was open myself to another world, a different POV, and I accept it as a valid one for others. Just because I don't enjoy it doesn't mean it is "stupid". I can't judge what someone else might find of value in some things, but that could mean that I am stupid, not they. I don't enjoy movies the way Ionesco does-- I couldn't sit still that long for so many movies without feeling I have lost a chunk of my life, but she loves it, and that's fine with me. If you haven't experienced life with sports, or been a fan of a sport, or raised your children in a sport, and yet refuse to give credence to people who have done these things and speak positively about it, it baffles me. It's like the redneck who says opera singing is screaming and refuses to admit there may be nuances he knows nothing about, but wants to know nothing about, having decided what the truth is and refusing to accept any other view. I love sports. I played on a summer league softball team growing up, and then I was a cheerleader and a swimmer. I think it rounded me off, a girl who also had a tendency to read too much, and spent hours at the piano. I married a baseball player, who at 50 is still out there pitching on a men's senior hardball league, and we raised two boys who were state champs in swimming, and played years of baseball, soccer, and basketball (no football- the one sport we didn't encourage). They certainly had no problems with obesity. They made friends through the teams, as did we, and they watched very little tv. They never had time for trouble. It provided a lot of balance in their lives. Baseball is a terrific relaxation for Dan after his high stress job and until the last ten years he also played basketball on a church team. Some people really hate the idea of gyms and repetitive workouts, or running to get nowhere. For them the group, the goals, the competition is what motivates them enough to be active. To Dan, who is an expert at the game, baseball is beautiful. As he used to joke, baseball is a metaphor for life for him. I don't think making fun of any activity that keeps children or adults active and enthusiastic about it is a bad thing. Where we could probably agree is that the emphasis is where sports goes wrong-- too much early competition, too serious a parent or coach, emphasis on the wrong values-- and I deplore the commercialization of not just college, but even high school sports. But making fun of people hitting a ball or swimming laps--- well- I think calling all sports "stupid" is exactly that. Someone might think watching every movie in the world is stupid, or reading all the books we do is stupid. Why be one of those kinds of people who can't accept that there are some wonderful positives about sports and kids, despite the evidence of many parents who have actually raised their children in sports, or are adults who still participate. And once you have engaged in a sport, and learned the nuances and strategies, something that appears meaningless to the ignorant, is filled with beauty and grace and even intelligence. We here tend to value the academic and intellectual life above all else. We need to guard against the narrowing of our own lives, and the condemnation of those things we may not fully understand. (Ionesco and I have had this sports conversation before a couple of times, and probably will again, since I just don't seem to gain any ground! She is a terrific defensive linesman)