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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Maurice Winn who wrote (182092)2/18/2006 1:21:03 PM
From: greenspirit  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 281500
 
Maurice, leftist elites turn their brain off all the time and say "it's in the N.Y. Times".

It's not religion that the real enemy, it's ignorance and the inability to think for oneself.

You see it all the time on threads like this one. People reacting like knee jerk lemmings to say an accidental shooting and spouting the same lines heard elsewhere.

Ignorance and pack animal thinking is the root cause of the problem.

Not religion.

Stalin followers were not religious. Neither were Hitler's henchmen.

But we've had this argument before. You need to get over being spanked by that nun in grade school. ;-)



To: Maurice Winn who wrote (182092)2/18/2006 2:57:45 PM
From: Noel de Leon  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
"Have you ever tried reasoning with religious people? They deliberately turn their brain off ...."
Just tried to reason with you. You proved your point. "deliberately turn their brain off "



To: Maurice Winn who wrote (182092)2/20/2006 10:02:39 AM
From: carranza2  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 281500
 
It's not racist to have contempt for religion. It's sensible.

I think it best to tolerate those who espouse religious beliefs since, in the main, religion is a good thing. It socializes barbarians, instills standards of good behavior, and comforts the believers. On the other hand, there are religions that get kidnapped by fanatics, a phenomenon which is obviously happening to Islam. Such religions naturally become dangerous. Catholicism during the Inquisition is an example. On the whole, however, this has not happened to any major religions, except for Islam, in the last few centuries. We can thank modernity and secularism for that.

It is hard to believe that we are about to witness the mass induction of millions into a deadly cult in this day and age.

What to do?

We cannot appease this nonsense.

We cannot tolerate it for it grows like a cancer.

We can of course support moderate Muslims who are fighting the radicals. They are few and far between, about to be fatwaed into oblivion as apostates. Ironically, our support of Muslim moderates brands them as opponents of the one true faith and therefore candidates for a good head chopping. This is a good thing, but not an effective one.

I suppose we need to get down to the roots of this insanity. In this regard, I think we have their rejection of modernism on our hands caused by Muslim failures in the last few centuries. It is a very human response to failure. If I, for example, try to design software and find that my education, intelligence, aptitude, etc., is not up to snuff, my reaction might very well be to reject software and its benefits, to blame others for my failure, and to sulk instead of strive to achieve mastery of the subject. These reactions are of course couterproductive, but I am sure that the psychological phenomenon is not rare. I might become a radicalized enemy of software, computers, etc., rather than someone who tries to work on my strengths. My distaste for these modernities might be exacerbated by the fact that my neighbor is a wizard at such things. My envy might lead me to want to burn his house, call him a pigdog, whatever.

Have this dynamic occur at a cultural/religious level and you have the real makings for a disaster.

I think, therefore, that the solution is to somehow bring self-actualized modernity into Islam, somehow foster Muslim achievement in science, technology, etc., and to allow the values that modernity brings with it, i.e,. tolerance, freedom, respect for diversity, etc., grow organically instead of being imposed from the top.

I just hope that the solution I propose takes place before nukes explode, in which case all bets are off. The solution will take decades to have success, unfortunately, and I don't think we have enough time, so put your helmet on, and don't fall off any more trees. We are going to need all the help we can get to both try to fight radical Islam while at the same time we convince all Muslims that the scientific method, tolerance, freedom, and democracy are the foundations of the one true religion named "modernity."