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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Hawkmoon who wrote (195397)8/6/2006 7:29:45 PM
From: sylvester80  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 281500
 
JUST IN: HEZBOLLAH STRIKES DIRECT HIT AGAINST IDF

Hezbollah rockets pound northern Israel
At least 15 dead, including 12 Israeli reservists
The Associated Press
URL: msnbc.msn.com
Updated: 3:50 p.m. MT Aug 6, 2006

KFAR GILADI, Israel - A defiant Hezbollah pounded northern Israel with rockets Sunday after rejecting a U.S.-French truce proposal, killing at least 15 people. Israel also struck hard, killing 14 in Lebanon as both sides tried to take advantage of the days before a U.N. resolution is put to a vote.

In the deadliest attack on Israelis in this war, a rocket landed Sunday among reservists near the entrance to the communal farm of Kfar Giladi on the Lebanese border. It killed 12 soldiers heading for battle in Lebanon and wounded five, hospital officials said.

Hezbollah rockets also hit Haifa, Israel’s third-largest city, killing three civilians and wounding dozens. Flames shot from damaged homes as firefighters tried to rescue panicked residents.

In Lebanon, the dead included five members of one family crushed in their home by an Israeli air strike. Warplanes attacked near Beirut and in the south, where some villages were bombed continually for a half-hour, security officials said.

Intent on maximum damage?
The fighting has intensified since the U.S. and France proposed a cease-fire resolution on Saturday which could soon be put to a vote in the U.N. Security Council. Both sides seem intent on inflicting maximum damage on each other before the vote.

Hezbollah and its chief allies, Iran and Syria, rejected the draft resolution because it does not call for an immediate Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon and does not address other Lebanese demands.

Mohammed Fneish, one of two Hezbollah members of the Lebanese Cabinet, said Saturday the militant group would not abide by a cease-fire resolution while Israeli troops remain on Lebanese territory.

Some 10,000 Israeli soldiers are fighting several hundred Hezbollah gunmen in that area, trying to track and destroy rocket launchers. Israel says it won’t leave until a multinational force has been deployed.

The U.S.-French plan envisions a second resolution in a week or two that would authorize an international military force and create a buffer zone in south Lebanon.

Rice notes ‘first step’ toward progress
In Washington, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice called the measure “the first step, not the only step.” Israel has not commented, except to say the draft is important.

The proposed resolution says the two Israeli soldiers held by Hezbollah should be released unconditionally. The soldiers’ capture July 12 triggered the war.

Hezbollah has fired more than 3,000 rockets at Israel since the fighting began and dozens hit on Sunday, Israeli officials said. Meanwhile, Israeli warplanes have struck hundreds of targets across Lebanon.

The attack on Kfar Giladi was “a direct hit on a vehicle where there was a crowd. They were all wounded and scattered in every direction, some of them were in very bad condition,” said Eli Peretz, a medic. “It was a very, very difficult scene. I have never seen anything like it.”

Bloodied army boots were placed on a stone wall. The rocket scorch two parked cars.

Upon hearing of the slain reservists, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert told the weekly Cabinet meeting, “Lucky that we are dealing with Hezbollah today, and not in another two or three years,” according to a participant.

Later Sunday, a rocket barrage hit the northern port city of Haifa, killing three civilians, injuring more than 40 and bringing down two buildings. A crowded residential district took five or six hits.

Three hours later, Israeli warplanes attacked the Lebanese town of Qana and destroyed the launchers that fired rockets on Haifa, the army said.

An Israeli attack on Qana last week killed 29 civilians. After an inquiry, Israel said the attack was a mistake and it would not have struck the building if it new civilians were inside. But it also accused Hezbollah of shielding rocket launching sites behind civilians.

Sunday’s deaths brought to 93 the number of Israelis killed, including 45 soldiers, the 12 reservists and 36 civilians. Israel’s attacks on Lebanon have killed at least 591 people, including 509 civilians, 29 Lebanese soldiers and 53 Hezbollah guerrillas.

14 killed in Lebanon
Israeli air strikes killed 14 Lebanese on Sunday, including 12 civilians, a Lebanese soldier and a Palestinian militant. In the southern town of Naqoura and several villages near Tyre, residents called rescue officials to report more people trapped under the rubble of crushed buildings, but crews could not retrieve the dead because of continued bombardment.

Explosions rang across Beirut as warplanes fired more than six missiles into Hezbollah strongholds in districts just south of the capital.

Hezbollah announced the deaths of three of its fighters, but did not say when they died. That would bring Hezbollah’s total of fighters killed to 53. But Israeli officials said they have confirmed 165 dead guerrillas — and even have their names — and estimated that another 200 had been killed. Israel said some 300 Hezbollah fighters remained in the area Israel was occupying in south Lebanon.

One air strike hit south Beirut just minutes after Arab League Secretary-General Amr Moussa touched down at a nearby airport. Missiles also struck in that area as Syrian Foreign Minister Walid Moallem stood next to his Lebanese counterpart and declared Israel would never defeat the hardened guerrilla force.

Arab League foreign ministers were to meet in Beirut on Monday for a hastily convened session.

Egyptian Foreign Minister Ahmed Aboul Gheit, speaking in Cairo, said the gathering “is a clear message to the world to show the Arab solidarity with the Lebanese people and in support of their demands.”

Syrian official ‘ready’ to aid Hezbollah
Moallem, the Syrian foreign minister, said the cease-fire draft resolution “adopted Israel’s point of view only.”

“As Syria’s foreign minister I hope to be a soldier in the resistance,” said Moallem, the first top Syrian official to visit Lebanon since Damascus ended a 29-year military presence in Lebanon last year.

Lebanon’s parliament speaker and Hezbollah’s negotiator, Nabih Berri, said the plan was unacceptable because it would leave Israeli troops in Lebanon and does not deal with Beirut’s key demands — a release of prisoners held by Israel and moves to resolve a dispute over the Chebaa Farms border area.

“If Israel has not won the war but still gets all this, what would have happened had they won?” Berri said. “Lebanon, all of Lebanon, rejects any talks and any draft resolution” that do not address the Lebanese demands, he said.

The Lebanese government on Sunday asked the U.N. to revise the draft, demanding that Israel pull its forces out immediately with the end of hostilities.

Iran on Sunday gave its ally Hezbollah a green light to keep fighting in Lebanon, saying that the United States cannot be a mediator in the crisis because of its support for Israel.

Many in the U.S., Europe, the Arab world and Israel accuse Iran of fueling the warfare in Lebanon through Hezbollah, in a bid to show its regional strength. Iran denies it is arming the guerrillas.

URL: msnbc.msn.com



To: Hawkmoon who wrote (195397)8/6/2006 7:43:17 PM
From: jttmab  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
Because you can't logically understand that this is exactly what Hizbullah's presence in Lebanon has done to that country.

No, because the phrase in question was about Israel handling Israeli radicals...Let's look at your incoherent sentence again....

I think the Israelis can handle their own radicals WHEN they opt to use violence to not only wage war against a neighboring country, but also militarily undermine the duly elected government of the country...

See the first part of your sentence....I think the Israelis can handle their own radicals...

That's about the Israelis and their own radicals. As it is the lead in part of the sentence, that is the main topic. Then that lead is followed by the word WHEN. This tells the reader that the Israelis will take care of their own radicals after something occurs. You with me so far?

Ok. You may recall that we were talking about a Rabinical Council and their position on "no innocents" in a war, which you wanted to confront because all radicals should be confronted.

Now you go into the WHEN they opt to use violence to not only wage war against a neighboring country, but also militarily undermine the duly elected government of the country...

Now you're saying that before Israel confronts this radical Rabinnical council, the council must first wage war against a neighboring country AND undermine the duly elected government of the country.

I'm not exactly sure which country you are referring to here, whether it's the country of Israel or the country of the neighboring country that the Rabinnical Council is militarily attacking. I think grammatically the structure indicates the undermining the government of the country they are attacking.

Of course this bears no resemblance to the situation in Lebanon as Hezbollah is not undermining the government of either Israel or Lebanon. Hezbollah has seats in parliament and their representatives were duly elected. This is another instance where you don't much care for democracy when they elect the wrong people. If they vote for people you don't like, democracy doesn't count any more. I really think it would be more fair if the US would give the people of Lebanon a list of people they aren't allowed to vote for in their democracy.

So at one time you wanted to confront all radicals and in your very next post you wanted to wait until the Rabinnical Council invaded another country and undermined someone's government Basically, the Rabinnical Council had to be worse than Hezbollah before anything would be done. And then it was only Israel that should be able to confront them. Forget about anyone else.

I therefore find your sentence incoherent, but maybe the word drivel or insane is better. I'm flexible on the best word.

jttmab



To: Hawkmoon who wrote (195397)8/6/2006 10:41:21 PM
From: jttmab  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
You can't understand that those 12,000 rockets were JUST AS MUCH A TOOL OF INTIMIDATION against the Lebanese Government, as they were against Israel.

When you come up with a statement from the Lebanese Government that they were intimidated by the 12,000 rockets let me know and I'll agree. Until then it's just wild ass speculation.

In the short-term, I would agree. But with a UN presence and a Chapter VII mandate for the disarming of Hizbullah, and separation between the two countries, it will logical that many Lebanese are going to be questioning just what Hizbullah brought down upon them. They are going to be looking for someone to blame and right now it's Israel.

You may recall that was the prediction of the incursion, i.e., it would unite the Lebanese against Hezbollah. The prediction couldn't have been more wrong.

But later, when the Israelis clear out, it's going to be Hizbullah that catches the flack, IMO. Some may still consider them to be "heroes".

Of course they'll be heroes. Hezbollah is the only army to have ever beaten back the Israelis; not only once, but twice.

jttmab



To: Hawkmoon who wrote (195397)8/7/2006 12:16:22 AM
From: SARMAN  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
Hizbullah, armed and financed by Syria and Iran, have no excuse for dragging Lebanon into this conflict.
Yet Israel uses the collective punishment. Destroying Lebanese civilian infrastructure and killing children.