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Politics : The Environmentalist Thread -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Wharf Rat who wrote (12106)	5/1/2007 2:36:59 PM
From: Wharf Rat	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 36917

Arctic melt faster than forecast By Richard Black Environment correspondent, BBC News website Arctic summer ice has been shrinking by about 9% per decade Arctic ice is melting faster than computer models of climate calculate, according to a group of US researchers. Since 1979, the Arctic has been losing summer ice at about 9% per decade, but models on average produce a melting rate less than half that figure. The scientists suggest forecasts from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) may be too cautious. The latest observations indicate that Arctic summers could be ice-free by the middle of the century. "Somewhere in the second half of the century, it would happen," said Ted Scambos of the National Snow and Ice Data Center (NSIDC) at the University of Colorado. The fact that all models show ice loss over the observed period and all project large ice losses into the future is a very strong message Marika Holland "Some computer models show periods of great sensitivity where the Arctic ice system collapses suddenly, and that trend may occur a bit earlier; that's the best guess, but exactly when it's hard to say," he told the BBC News website. Dr Scambos co-authored the latest study, published in the journal Geophysical Research Letters, with other scientists from NSIDC and from the National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR), also in Boulder, Colorado. They also calculate that about half, if not more, of the warming observed since 1979 originates in humanity's emissions of greenhouse gases. Model perfection There are measurements dating back about a century on the extent of Arctic ice, but satellite observations from 1979 onwards are generally thought to provide the most accurate dataset. The new research involved analysing two periods, 1953-2006 and 1979-2006. The real world looks to be changing faster than the models predict Records show a shrinkage over the longer period of 7.8% per decade. When only the more recent period is analysed, the rate rises to 9.1% per decade. For comparison, the researchers looked at a collection of 18 computer models used by the IPCC and other institutions for making projections of future climates. Models are always verified against real-world data from the recent past to see how well their output mimics reality. The collection scrutinised here calculated an average decline of only 2.5% per decade for 1953-2006, and 4.3% per decade since 1979 - both well short of the real-world observations. "There are lessons here for the climate modelling community," acknowledged NCAR's Marika Holland. "The rate of ice loss, and the location of ice loss - these are things that the models need to improve, and there are physical processes such as the release of methane from melting permafrost that the models don't include." Constant picture This is the third time in the last few months that studies have suggested the IPCC's latest major global climate analysis, the Fourth Assessment Report, is too conservative. Air temperatures are rising with respect to the 1961-1990 average In December, a German team published research suggesting that sea levels could rise by 50-140cm over the coming century. The IPCC, in February, gave a range of 28-43cm. Then, also in February, came an analysis showing that temperature and sea level rises had been rising at or above the top end of IPCC projections since the panel's previous major assessment in 2001. This is the opposite view from that put forward by many "climate sceptics", who view the whole field of computer modelling as deeply flawed, and the IPCC as an alarmist organisation. Because of the way it works, the IPCC is bound to be conservative, as it assesses in considerable depth research already in the public domain. This process takes time, and means the panel's conclusions will always lag behind the latest publications. Nevertheless, Marika Holland believes there is agreement on the major questions regarding Arctic ice; it is receding, and greenhouse gases of human origin are largely responsible. "The fact that all models show ice loss over the observed period and all project large ice losses into the future is a very strong message," she said news.bbc.co.uk

To: Wharf Rat who wrote (12106)	5/1/2007 4:40:04 PM
From: miraje	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 36917

The rich world's policy on greenhouse gas now seems clear: millions will die What a ridiculous crock of nonsense. George Monbiot Tuesday May 1, 2007 The Guardian He should change his name to George Moonbat.. A large dose of reality is sorely needed here, but first, a short digression. I've never understood the need of the vast majority of humans to embrace religion, whether of the supernatural sort or any of the secular statist flavors. Apropos the subject at hand, it's interesting, as others have pointed out, how many worshippers of the thoroughly discredited Church of Red have morphed into rabid followers of the Church of Green. Anyway, here's reality. All the Kyoto Treaties, Prius cars, Sheryl Crowe uni-paper butt wipes, Algore movies, bio this and eco that, et cetera, ad nauseam, are going to accomplish exactly zero in affecting global climate changes. If one believes (as green worshippers do and I don't) that human produced greenhouse gas emissions will cause imminent and catastrophic global consequences, then what choices to pursue narrow down to just these.. Fact #1: To lower CO2 emissions enough to revert to pre industrial atmospheric levels would necessitate throttling the world economy to such an extreme extent that many more than George Moonbat's millions would die as a result. Fact #2: If and when policies are implemented beyond the touchy feely, useless nonsense currently being promulgated by green church members (see above), policies that severely cut not only emissions, but peoples standards of living, an inevitable backlash will occur. Fact #3: There are currently no magic bullets to meaningfully decarbonize civilizations energy requirements enough to affect global climate and there won't be for some decades to come, no matter how much church members, the MSM and politicians pontificate to the contrary. Fact #4: The ONLY way to substantially lower atmospheric CO2 levels, without destroying the world's economy, is through deploying CO2 capture and sequestration technologies. They do exist. I wonder if and when any flavor of church is going to wake up and start worshipping there....