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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Mary Cluney who wrote (38761)	6/25/2007 5:23:40 PM
From: epicure	Respond to of 541736

I'm not sure what you are trying to say. I grew up with right wingers in Orange County. I would generalize this far- that right wingers often can hurt those on the fringes of society, like gays, by creating laws, or a societal climate, hostile to those people. On the other hand, the right wingers see those people as "ill", and many of them feel they are actually "helping" these people by punishing them, or making life hostile for them. I don't know how you resolve that issue. Obviously people like us, who think people ought to be able to do whatever they want with their personal lives, as long as they don't hurt others (hurt not being defined as the emotional pain of seeing immorality) have problems with people who would crush people on the fringes. On the other hand right wing folks donate a lot of money to charity, often religious charities, but still, a donation is a donation- and they think it's a social "good". So they think they are do gooders, and how can we tell them they aren't? There have been studies that claim they do even more good than liberals. I kind of doubt that, since I think a lot of liberal do gooding is less formalized, and if it isn't, for example, under the umbrella of a formal charity I'm not sure good work gets counted. But whatever the metric used to calculate good works, I feel sure that most people do them, and most people do not want to see other people hurt- regardless of what political party they belong to.

To: Mary Cluney who wrote (38761)	6/26/2007 2:01:11 AM
From: ManyMoose	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541736

Tree huggers for the most part do not want to harm anyone or anything. I have a good deal of experience in this area, and your statement is simply not true. The people you are talking about want to destroy an entire economy and way of life in order to achieve their self-righteous objectives, and when it comes to the law of unintended consequences they do not have a clue. That is, if they really didn't want to destroy a way of life and an economy their actions had the same effect anyway. And, ecologically speaking, they don't have the slightest idea of what the consequence of their behaviors are. Tree huggers are just people who like to make a lot of noise and get their picture in the paper by hanging off balconies with their signs or burning down the legal rights and property of others. True conservationists are those with dirt under their fingernails, who get their vegetables from the ground, who get their meat by killing it first hand, and who are part of the ecosystem rather than apart from it. Mind you, I have great love for trees and I've devoted my entire professional life to seeing that they prosper.