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To: roto who wrote (44718)	7/13/2007 1:37:14 PM
From: E. Charters	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 78412

Socialism with independent means is a contradiction in basic terms. You have to realize that to be an idealist you should burn your money, because when your fave poli system gets it final way nobody will have any except people who work for the government. And that will be fake money, declining in value hourly. 65% of the GDP of Canada is the civil service wages and outlays. The 65% service sector of the G7 nations is because their civil service is just that part of the economy. It is unsustainable and the primary reason for rampant inflation and decline in available money to replace infrastructure. I can date the beginning of the decline in private sector capability and the rise of government at about 1968. After that only government grew in real terms. And it has reached its limit. No more people can possibly be hired. The decline in infrastructure and sustainable cities has begun in earnest. And the civil unions are crying for more money and less work, while the politicians argue over an ever declining money pie. None of them see that there just isn't enough to go around no matter how you split it up. The only way to advance is to lay off 65% of the civil service and try to rebuild basic industry. We are talking 2 million employees in Canada. That would be a saving of 175 billion per year. It ain't much, but it's a start. EC<:-}

To: roto who wrote (44718)	7/13/2007 2:32:30 PM
From: koan	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 78412

Socialism as a concept is a very admirable idea. It's the idea of social cooperation. The strong helping the weak and the fortunate helping the less fortunate. the positive idea of socialism gets bastardized by unsophisticated thinking. Eldridge Cleaver said it best: "competition is the law of the jungle and copperation is the law of civilization." All civilized modern socieities are one form of a welfare state or another. As they should be. A combination of capiialism and socialism. People also mix up economic systems with political systems. Sweden for instance, is a socialized democracy. China is a socialized dictatorship. Some people are greedy and do not like to share, so they dislike the idea of socialism. Society has the right and indeed the obligation to force them to share.