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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (237572)	7/23/2007 7:09:18 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Nobody "proved" what got shipped to Syria (and what didn't), not you, and not anyone else- but when it comes to resolving doubts, I'd say your track record is against you if we are "guessing" about what happened. My guess? Truckloads of cash and valuables to be stashed in comfy hidey holes. Dictators who think their time may be up are a lot more concerned with valuables than they are with WMD. I don't know why more people haven't mentioned this possibility. There were huge sums of money missing when Iraq was invaded. Now some people say a lot of that money was looted- but what if it had already been shipped out? Were I in Saddam's spot, I would have been shipping valuables out just as fast as I could.

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (237572)	7/23/2007 9:03:51 PM
From: Win Smith	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Meanwhile, back in the reality based community, it's up to the people proposing fantastic theories to back them up. You don't get to conjure something up and then claim other people have to disprove it , or it's true. I know things work differently in W's world, but that's life.

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (237572)	7/24/2007 11:31:45 AM
From: cnyndwllr	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

"Oh really? Somebody proved what got shipped from Iraq to Syria in 2002 and 2003? Evidence, please?" Nadine, how can a dialogue with you progress when after your assumptions are debunked you simply go back to square one and repeat the same simplistic assertions over and over again? We've had this discussion before, more than once and I know you haven't forgotten but for those who might not have read those previous posts the plain and simple answer is.... No one proved what stuff got shipped out of Iraq because if it wasn't wmds no one cared. What they did prove was what did NOT GET SHIPPED OUT OF IRAQ....WMDs. And they spend literally hundreds of millions of dollars and employed the scarce resources of our most specialized Middle Eastern military and civilian personnel, pulling them off the search for Bin Laden and Al Queda, to do it. And in their attempts to "prove" the existence of wmds they used huge monetary incentives, threats and even torture of the Iraqis who would have known. And that huge wmd search program was run by devoted Bush partisans who wouldn't take "no" for an answer and who put extreme pressure on the team to come up with something, ANYTHING, to "prove" that wmds, any wmds no matter how inconsequential, had existed, had been recently destroyed or had been recently removed from Iraq. And all they came up with was some guy who'd buried a piece of equipment decades before. But that was enough for you. The simple fact is that there was no one to say that in the years immediately preceding our invasion wmds had existed, were hidden, were built, were destroyed, were secreted out or were disguised as playground toys. No one. Not under torture, not for millions of dollars of "reward money" and the promise of a life anywhere in the world, not for anything. Not a truck driver, not a technician, not a scientist, not a warehouse worker, not a janitor, not an assembly worker, not a whore, not a wife of someone who knew and talked, not a draftsman, not a clerk, not anyone in the Iraqi government or outside of the government, not a single document among the mountains of documents that opened up to us...NO ONE, NOTHING. Are you getting the picture? Hundreds of millions of dollars spent, tens of thousands of scarce and specialized man hours expended and zip, nada, nothing. NOT ONE DAMN THING. So who still maintains that we "don't know." Not the thinking world, not the experts in the field, not dufus Dubya, not even Cheney or Rice? Just you Nadine, and a handful of people like you who blindly believe what they want to believe unless it really costs them something personally. And with a lot of other people paying a horrible blood price for grossly erroneous mistakes in judgement or outright lies, it's really not costing you anything to continue to assert the debunked lies of the past, is it? After all, if you don't admit you're wrong then you can always deny that you're wrong. That's a page out of George W Bush's book that you seem to have read and absorbed. So, I'm back to replying to you with the one sentence that answers so many of your oft repeated, red herring, intentionally ignorant assertions; "That's been debunked." Ed