Should You Buy a Second-Hand Prius?
Maintenance costs may outstrip fuel savings
By Joe Benton
ConsumerAffairs.com
April 4, 2008
Toyota Prius
Toyota Prius • General Complaints
• Availability
• Battery
• Fuel Gauge
• Insurance Costs
• Service Delays
• Tires
• Transmission
• Happy Hybrid Owners
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Test Drive
• Three Lead Feet Meet Little Fuel Sipper
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News
• Reports of Prius Price Gouging Rise with Gas Prices
• Prius, Porsche Models Top Most-Satisfied Lists
• Should You Buy a Second-Hand Prius?
• Winter Weather Warning for Prius Drivers
• Prius Again Tops Owner Satisfaction Survey
• Prius Helps Toyota Knock Off Ford for #2 Spot
• Toyota Recalls Floor Mats, NHTSA Warns Prius Owners
• Feds Probe Prius Runaway Acceleration
• Prius Owners Report More Unintended Acceleration Incidents
• Runaway Acceleration Plagues Prians
• Toyota Delays Third-Generation Prius
• Sales Top 1 Million but Some Owners Find Prius Doesn't Age Well
• Prius Owners Losing Ground in Traction Battle
• Prius Traction Control Complaints on the Rise
• Prius Stalls in Snow; Owners Steamed
• Prius Shuts Down in the Snow, Reader Complains
• Prius Supplies Increase as Sales Slow
• Prius Discounts Popping Up in Showrooms
• EPA Finds Prius #1 in Gas Mileage
• Prius Owners Question Mileage Claims
• Prius Tops Consumer Satisfaction Survey
• Hybrids Don't Always Deliver the Expected Fuel Economy
Since the summer of 2000 more than 500,000 Prius hybrids have quietly filled U.S. roads and highways. Now many of the sophisticated little cars are showing up in used car lots as second-hand gas sippers.
With sales of new hybrids increasing by almost 30 percent a year and gasoline prices following at a faster pace, a second-hand hybrid can appear to be a smart alternative in a tight economy.
But because of the car's relatively new design, there is little information available to help consumers judge the reliability of a used Prius other than reports from previous Prius owners.
Consumer beware. The risks may be higher than you think.
Battery blues
Doris in Smithville, Tennessee bought a used Prius in July 2006.
“Trying to inform myself prior to buying the car, I asked about the battery and was told never had they seen the whole battery fail, only a cell at a time to the tune of $200 per cell,” she was told. “I did not want to spend the money on a brand-new Prius. I wanted to test the waters on a used one first.”
The decision to buy a second had hybrid was costly.
The 2006 Prius had 73,200 miles on the odometer leaving 26,800 remaining on the hybrid battery warranty. “I bought it and thought I was living the dream, but only for a moment,” Doris told ConsumerAffairs.com.
When the weather turned cold her Prius would have no power. The engine was difficult to start. “Finally it went totally down,” she said. “No power!”
The Toyota dealer told Doris at first that she must have over-filled the gas tank and may have ruined the Prius computer system. The repair cost would be $1,900.
One year later the Prius lost all power while driving at 65 mph on an Interstate highway. "I was scared to death,” Doris wrote. The Prius was towed to a dealer and Doris was told “the main battery was down it would be $6,890 to fix it.”
Remember, the first dealer told her the battery never failed completely and the replacement cost would be roughly $2,000.
Doris was lucky as things turned out.
“They called tech support and found it was a leaf sucked up in a filter which in turn prevented gas and air from going to the battery and drained it." Doris spent $225 to tow the Prius to the dealer and $276 to charge the main battery plus tax, a lot less than the original $6,890 repair estimate but still $549.85.
But not all the repair news was good. "They told me it could happen again. So I'm stuck with what I feel is a defective product. I'm Toyota's rolling gunea pig,” she said. “I cannot trade the car because they tell I'm $5,500 up side down," she said. “I have to buy a new car to roll this amount with it. I can't afford a new car with a $425 per month payment.”
Transmission troubles
In Loomis, California, Sam tells the tale of expensive repairs with his 2003 Prius.
After a series of problems with the Prius engine, Toyota informed Sam that he needed to have the transmission replaced. The estimate for repairs was around $7,000, almost the value of the entire vehicle, according to Sam.
“Naturally the vehicle was no longer covered by the warranty,” he said.
The Prius had 116,289 miles on the odometer when the car began to malfunction. The check-engine light came on and the engine quickly shut down. The dealership informed Sam that the gasoline engine quit because the battery ran out of juice. The dealership checked the spark plugs and coils, detected slight misfire until warm but could not reproduce the problem. The cost of the service was $123.77.
The repair bill seemed too good to be true. And it was.
When the problem occurred a second time, the Toyota dealership said that the “problem was not really the spark plugs but that the sophisticated hybrid transmission needed to be replaced. The estimate for the parts and labor for this repair would be approximately $2,000.” The estimate was quickly revised to $7,000 with parts and labor. The “cost of the new transmission alone was $5,000,” Sam reported.
Early adopter
In Sunnyvale, California, Matt was one of the original 2001 Prius hybrid owners.
“Now, after 130,000 miles of driving the main battery is dead. The Toyota dealer is telling me the life of the main battery was 100,000 for my car, although the new Prius comes with a 150,000-mile warranty,” he said.
Matt said that the dealer told him he was the third Prius owner to require a main battery replacement.
“Labor and parts, plus tax was $4,500. Unfortunately, there is no third-party service provider who knows how to fix Prius,” he said.
Matt warns consumers interested in a second hand Prius to be prepared to pay $4,500 for the main battery before 150,000 miles have been recorded on the odometer.”
Complexity
That is not all.
“The car is loaded with electronics and solid state controllers. Be prepared to pay outrageous prices for diagnostics and repair. Very rarely you will walk out with a bill costing under $300,” Matt said.
“You will pay nearly $150 for having a duplicate key made to your Prius. That is because the key apparently has an anti-theft chip which has to be programmed by Toyota,” he said.
There's no doubt the Prius gets good gas mileage (though perhaps not as good as many buyers expect). But whether the total cost of ownership is reasonable is another question indeed.
Consumers who need reliable, inexpensive transportation are still better off with a simple, straightforward economy car -- a Toyota Corolla, Honda Civic or something similar with a four-cylinder engine and a manual transmission are likely to provide trouble-free, economic transportation for hundreds of thousands of miles.
Here are some of the reports we've received from other Prius owners:
Geo of Huntsburg OH (06/15/08)
we bought a new 2002 toyota prius and with 20,000 miles on our original set and 50000 on our 2nd set we now have to buy a 3rd set of tires because the outer tread has worn down to the radial. these tires are supposed to last 65000 miles and neither toyota nor bridgestone will do anything about this potentially life threatening problem. We had the tires rotated, balanced and aligned as needed. In my opinion, if you want a eco freindly car buy a honda.
John of Winchester OR (06/13/08)
i made a righthand turn into trafic there was a small amount of rainwater on the road the tirer started to spin the car came to a stop on its own this was on a very bussy road i pushed the gas again and again . after a very long 12 or 15 sec. the tirer stopped spining and down the road i went. i,m glad the cares coming at me saw what was going on and gave me room. the car is dangerous. someone must make toyoya fix this.Don't get me started about trying to get up a gravel road; time to get out and push.
Michael of Willits CA (06/12/08)
The Traction Control system on my 2008 Toyota Prius is worthless. I have a steep gravel driveway that is extremely hard to climb due to the unnecessary engine cut outs, especially if there is any extra weight in the rear of the car. The engines quit when the computer senses any type of slippage; worse in the summer when gravel is dry. Also there are very noticeable engine cut outs when just going over bumps on level pavement. My previous Prius, a 2002, would slip a bit on the same driveway but I had much more control over the car and the speed compared to the new 2008, very acceptable. Heavier tires with more rubber on the road made little difference with the 2002; I expect the same when I get better tires on the 2008. Had I known about the problem with this earlier, as I have just found reported on the internet, I would not have purchased this car. I think Toyota should recall and correct these cars' problem. Perhaps a trade in on a 2009 model with optional on/off Traction Control as found in many other vehicles would work for me and others. The trade in could be prorated like the warranty on tires. But I should not have to take a big loss on selling the car after disclosing this problem to a potential buyer; Toyota should eat that loss. The argument that shutting down the power to the front wheels in all cases of slippage is ridiculous. If the issue of over spining the electric motor is the reason for this system, as pointed out in some of the chat rooms, how did the earlier years of Prius, such as the 2002 I had, get by without any such issues coming forward? I am now considering selling my 2008 Prius for something that works safely for me. Toyota should have informed the buying public of this limitation once it became an issue back in 2004 instead of denying the problem. I would join a class action suit against Toyota to get them to make this right. I appreciate Toyota for being on the cutting edge of technology and making sensible cars for our times but Toyota also has to take responsibility for their mistakes along the way. This Traction Control system is the worst thing to come along in a long time. Thank you for this forum.
Darlene of Woodland WA (06/11/08)
Well, it is official from Toyota Corporate ... if you do happen to have challenges filling your gas tank ... there is NO fix ... Toyota notes that 6 - 7 gallons at a fill up is normal! As having owned MANY cars, what is not normal is being able to acutally fill your gas tank.- ... :-( I am perosnally astounded and saddened that this design flaw has not yet been corrected, after years of complaints by Prius owners. Here is the response from Toyota Corporate ... you will note that they do encourage comments from owners. (You may also wish to contact and file complaints with the BBB, NHTSA, your state's Attroney General, Consumer Reports, and the NCDS - National Center for Dispute Settlement over the issues you are having with your Prius!) Subject Re: Prius gas tank safety issues Dear Ms. : We apologize with your dissatisfaction with the fuel tank bladder in your 2008 Prius. As your Case Manager explained to you, this is the design of the fuel tank and there is no repair available to change the design. We appreciate you taking the time to let us know of your dissatisfaction with the fuel tank bladder because the only way we know what our customers are looking for is when they tell us, as you have. We try to scope our customers out in advance, by researching the market, conducting interviews, surveys, focus groups and doing our homework, but there's no better source than a Toyota owner who takes the time to tell us like it is. We can't guarantee that a change would be made, but if it were, it would be driven by just this sort of honest communication. We have documented your email at our National Headquarters under file #. If we can be of further assistance, please feel free to contact us. Sincerely, Toyota Customer Experience
Chris of Casper WY (06/10/08)
We just bought a used 05 Prius and thought it would be great to get 60 miles/ gallon. Like others who hoped for 60 miles/gallon we have been disappointed. The on board computer reads about 41 to 43 around town. I have not figured the mileage by the old fashoined way but my guess is it is less than the computer. We have been huge Toyota fans for many years but this is really a huge letdown for our Toyota loyalty. We have had the vehicle for about a week and are thinking of selling it. Subaru or Honda are very appealing. |
