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Politics : Stockman Scott's Political Debate Porch -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: stockman_scott who wrote (78564)11/6/2008 10:22:53 PM
From: American Spirit  Read Replies (9) | Respond to of 89467
 
The GOP is cheating on senatorial races in Alaska and Georgia. Big-time. Expect a legal challenge.

Franken may be the real winner. There are more Dem uncounted votes. Only 480 separate them.



To: stockman_scott who wrote (78564)11/7/2008 12:33:30 PM
From: LTK007  Respond to of 89467
 
Is it time to weep? THE LEFT is ALL ALONE now.(i am a leftist) But this Gatto fellow hopes that the failure of Obama to deliver to their hopes, will be the final straw to wake liberals out their DELUSION that they live in a democracy.

i had a powerful dream the night of the election, power people with silver colored sunglaeess, dressed in black were machine gunning the already broken, in pool of blood, Thomas Jefferson .
A sign flashed "D/R The War Party."

The meaning of the dream obvious.

Mr. Gatto article

The Election: It Had To Be This Way

By Timothy V. Gatto

07 November, 2008
Countercurrents.org

The Democrats winning Congress and the White House just had to happen. If we are ever going to change this country from an empire to a representative democracy, we have to rid ourselves of the notion that one corporate political party can do anything toward that goal. Barack Obama will be the catalyst for a new movement, away from false hope and false promises, not because he will deliver to the people of this country anything worthwhile, but because he won’t. This will be the final nail in the coffin of our corporatist society.

There are so many so-called “progressives” that have believed that it was the Bush Republican neo-cons that have gotten us where we are. This is wishful thinking. The Democratic 110th Congress did nothing but rubber-stamp every bill that was put before it. Democrats have blindly caved in to fear of being called “anti-patriotic” if they voted against the meaningless war in Iraq. They put their political fortunes ahead of their conscience at every opportunity, from Pelosi taking impeachment “off the table” to voting for the new FISA bill that granted telecoms immunity from illegally working with the executive branch to illegally eavesdrop on US citizens. They passed every military budget and went along with almost every Bush attack on our civil liberties. How one could possibly imagine that Barack Obama or any other Democrat could undo the damage they helped to create is just wishful thinking.

This election had to happen this way if we are ever going to understand what we are up against. I voted for Barack Obama because it happened to be a win-win situation. The truth must be told and this is the only way to tell it. When the phony left, the ones who claim not to be liberals, but “progressives”, understand that there is not a dime’s worth of difference between the Corporate GOP and the Corporate Democrats, then we will see our way to a rebirth of our civil liberties. This is the only way to convince the die-hard Democrats that their party has changed, and not for the better. The American Empire is alive and well operating in concert with the DNC, make no mistake about it. I wish I was wrong, in fact I would welcome any type of change towards a real representative government that put the people first, but I am saddened when I write that all indications don’t point that way.

The time for real change is now. I must tell you that the change we seek will not come from the President-Elect, but from the disgust and anger we will all feel when corporate interests and the Military Industrial Complex (corporate welfare) dominate the Democrats agenda. War will not end; it will be moved to different theaters. We have seen both Obama and Biden accuse the Russians of aggression towards Georgia when most Americans realize that it was the other way around. These facts should not be lost on anyone. Many Progressives tell us that they will “hold the Democrats feet to the fire”. This is also wishful thinking. They said the same thing after the 2006 election. Their feet were unfettered and the only thing that was held to the fire was their concern for the majority of Americans that have been disgusted with their county’s behavior. Nothing changed with that Democratic Congress; excuse after excuse was silently borne by those Americans that should have known better.

Now the time has come to actually put up or shut up. Mr. Obama has already chosen a Democratic interventionist in Joe Biden, a man who never saw a war he didn’t like. The self-proclaimed Zionist that has stood with AIPAC since its inception, a man that ranks right up there with Bush when it comes to Iran and Palestine. Obama has also kowtowed to the Israeli’s, and there doesn’t seem to be any hope for those that want America to look at both sides of the tensions in the Middle East. We will blindly follow the Israelis as far as they wish to take us, for their own self-interests.

This is what we have to look forward to. We can count on the Democrats to put Wall Street first with more massive bailouts instead of fixing the root of the problems we have. Corporate self interest and government intervention will be the norm. I can see four years ahead when the Democrats will claim that President Obama only did what he had to do to ensure another term so then he will really be able to “fix” things. Maybe by then the majority of Americans will realize that they have been taken for a two decade ride. I can hope that by the time the next Presidential election comes along; both corporate political parties will be regulated to the dustbin of history.

I don’t want to make money or live in a militarily strong country. I don’t want to see America rule the world. I just want our country to do the right thing when it comes to its citizens. I want the middle class to grow again. I want our children to get a first class education. Terrorism is overstated and used to disguise wars for resources. We should be spending our time devising new alternative energies. We should be spending more on cancer research and less on weapons of war. We should be able to feed and clothe our poorest of citizens. We should stop borrowing against the future and we should be working to cure the ills of today. One more M1A1 Tank will not feed a community. The statues quo is criminal. It was devised and put in place by criminals. They should be charged for crimes against humanity.

Will this happen? I don’t believe it will. The next chance that comes along, recycled neo-cons will be put back in office four or eight years hence. We will continue to use the world for our military stomping ground. That is, unless we learn from what the new Democratic Congress and the new Democratic President will bring. I’m afraid we will again be hoodwinked. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. I’m hoping that won’t happen, but I have my doubts. I can only hope that Americans see this for what it is, and that’s just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Unless the Democrats develop some kind of conscience, or the American people develop some kind of awareness, I believe we are in for a very rough ride. Still, it has to be this way. I couldn’t have planned it better myself.

timgatto@hotmail.com

liberalpro.blogspot.com



To: stockman_scott who wrote (78564)11/7/2008 12:44:23 PM
From: LTK0071 Recommendation  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 89467
 
Stockman you once were opposed to the ultrazionist, now through this cultish fetish, you are NOW one with Ultra-Zionist. Why, because OBAMA has handpicked an ultra zionist, let's BOMB Iran super Hawk as his Chief of Staff no the less.
i will watch you all on this thread dissolve into degenerate
hypocrites.
You NOW StockMan a NEO-LIBERAL, sickening, isn't it.
Max is Proud To Say he Did NOT vote in this election---boycotted totttlt, as i at least have living mind that know democracy is DEAD.
Obama News:This will make the NEO-LIBERALS ala the bastard Christopher "The Only Good Muslim isd dead Muslim" Hitchens, REJOICE and the most liberals IGNORE or pathetically try to defend, as they immerse into the dirty world of HYPOCRISY--they can't say they were wrong, tey rather hell than say they were wrong.
Obama has picked Chief of Staff, that man quit powerful and a man the president selects is MOST FULLY IN AGREEMENT with, so he chose Rahm Emauel an aggressive unequical hawk in Foreigh Policy and an Ultre Zioninst.
OBAMA has already already BETRAYED the anti-war Mandate of the Public, he already as shown same old story as before, but with just differet domestic policy, i the view is the more they keep happy at home the better WE CAN KILL Overseas.

Many libs being SHALLOW, will remain loyal to him because down deep they REALLY DON'T GIVE A DAMN how many we kill of those foreigners.
Why? Because a Democrat is doing it, so MAGICALLY it becomes O.K.

And we few thar WARNED and WARNED abit this will be hated in more. A herd is a herd. And they have NO PLACE for Rads. iRAD
*************************************************

Forget the Honeymoon/RahnEmanuel chosem for Chief of Staff.
Getting down to bizness with Obama
by Justin Raimondo www.antiwar.com
(EDIT i can see all this will become my worst nighmare so so warned as will see many the feirce critics of Bush foreign policy, turn to HAWKS themselves--i just hope Amy Goodman, maintain her INTREGRITY and put Obama on the carpet as an ultra zionist and all the aggression that means tha swells within him. i repeat i am not a libertarian, but Raimondo is a superb writer about The One Party/The War Party Max)

When I hear talk of a "honeymoon" for the President-elect – to last as long as six months, by some accounts – I think: "Fine. You lay off, and I'll do the same." But oh no, it doesn't work that way. Obama has already started in on us, and he hasn't even taken the oath of office yet. I'm talking about his appointments, starting with Rahm Emanuel as his chief of staff.

Hey, I thought we were gong to be treated to a bipartisan approach by the Obama administration, that he was going to "reach across the aisle" – what happened to that? Señor Emanuel is known as a street-fightin' Democrat, and that's understating it. A Rolling Stone profile of Emanuel had this to say:

"There's the story of how, the night after Clinton was elected, Emanuel was so angry at the president's enemies that he stood up at a celebratory dinner with colleagues from the campaign, grabbed a steak knife and began rattling off a list of betrayers, shouting 'Dead! . . . Dead! . . . Dead!' and plunging the knife into the table after every name. 'When he was done, the table looked like a lunar landscape,' one campaign veteran recalls. 'It was like something out of The Godfather.'"

He's mean, he's ultra-partisan, and he's a fully-paid up member in good standing of the War Party: during the Democratic primaries in 2006, when Emanuel headed up the Dems' congressional operation, he backed pro-war candidates over antiwar Democrats every time. As Bill Safire put it on "Meet the Press" just before Tim Russert died:

"What about Rahm Emanuel [for Vice President], the most powerful voice in the House of Representatives that agrees with Hillary Clinton on foreign affairs? He's a hawk. And although he's a rootin' tootin' liberal on domestic affairs, he is a hawk on foreign affairs. I was at the – a roast for him for Epilepsy Association, and Hillary Clinton was there, and I said, quite frankly, here you have the hawkish side of the Democratic Party. If they get together, the bumper sticker will read 'Invade and bomb with Hillary and Rahm.'"(edit: how sad when i have to get reality spoken from a right wing pig like Safire--max)

When the House Democratic majority passed a military appropriations bill slated for Iraq, a clause that would have prohibited an attack on Iran without a vote in Congress was deleted at the instigation of Emanuel and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. When Rep. John Murtha presaged the popular rebellion against the Iraq war by coming out against it in no uncertain terms, Emanuel urged Pelosi to refrain from endorsing his call for withdrawal, arguing that it would hurt the Democrats politically.

With the smiling face of Don Obama serving as a front for the knife-wielding Emanuel and his "legendary intensity" – as Rolling Stone writer Joshua Green puts it – one has to wonder: what (or who) else does the Prez-elect have in store for us?

The answer is: Jane Harman – as head of the CIA! (If she doesn't get it, not to worry: she's also up for head of Homeland Security – and if she doesn't get that, she's on the short list for National Intelligence czarina).

Will somebody go see if Glenn Greenwald is okay? I fear he may have done something drastic, especially after all that gushing he's done over the Dear Leader.

Harman has always taken the side of the Bushies when it comes to eavesdropping: during Gen Michael Hayden's confirmation hearings for CIA director, she was against making government eavesdropping an issue. When the New York Times revealed the illegal eavesdropping program authorized by Bush, she was outraged – at the Times, which she strongly hinted ought to be prosecuted. She was pro-war, and did her part in spreading the "bad intel" she now claims to have been fooled by – declaring not only that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, but also purveying the rather far-out notion that al-Qaeda had taken up residence there prior to the US invasion.

Harman's ambition is matched only by her recklessness: she came up against the FBI, in 2006, when she was investigated for going a little too far in her aggressive campaign to retain her seat as head of the House Intelligence Committee. Apparently she had AIPAC officials and major Democratic donors personally lobby Pelosi, in return for the promise that she, Harman, would intercede on behalf of Steve Rosen and Keith Weissman, two top AIPAC officials currently being prosecuted for stealing US top secret intelligence and passing it on to Israeli officials. Law enforcement officials aver hard evidence for this quid pro quo was never uncovered. I'm hoping, however, that some Republican back-bencher has the balls to bring it up at her confirmation hearing. Perhaps they could call Pelosi as a witness.

Combined with the foreign policy views of Dennis Ross, Obama's senior advisor for Middle East affairs – who is reportedly up for the National Security Advisor slot – what seems to be shaping up is a perfect trifecta of trouble on the horizon. The old adage that presidents rarely govern in synch with the way they campaign applies here, and in spades. Change? Not in the foreign policy realm, buster. Indeed, if any change is involved, it may well be for the worse.

By the time Obama is through making his appointments, all those Hollywood liberals over at the HuffPuffPost will be huffing and puffing with outrage: and, in true Hollywood style, they'll be screaming: "Forget the honeymoon – I want a divorce!"

But it will be too late for that. The Big O marches on, with all sorts of plans for our future, including perhaps "national service," and – for sure – a significant ratcheting-up of the war in Afghanistan. In the meantime, Iran continues to loom large as an issue.

Just as Obama was claiming his victory, the Iranians were warning us to stay away from their airspace – there have apparently been a number of close calls recently. Also, the Russians announced they were putting missiles near their border with Poland, to counter the sophisticated anti-missile "defense" systems put in place by the US and its Eastern European ally. Adding insult to injury, the official explanation for the US deployment is that the anti-missile system is there to guard against an Iranian attack. Whether the Obama-ites buy into this sort of malarkey or not isn't clear. What is all too obvious, however, is that President Obama will continue the West's war of words – and "soft power" – against the Russians, a prospect that bodes ill for the cause of peace.

So, you thought you were turning over a whole new leaf for the country when you marked your ballot for the Dear Leader – didn't you? Well, surprise – surprise!

~ Justin Raimondo