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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: epicure who wrote (122162)	10/4/2009 12:45:53 AM
From: E	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542214

I got home a while ago from a dinner party. Eight liberals there, two conservatives. Without dissension, it was agreed in a five minute conversational reference to the case that given the account of what happened at the time [i'd earlier read the transcript below of the girl's description], Polanski should be in prison for whatever the number of years the law calls for in cases of drugging and forcibly raping and sodomizing a child. I think such a sentence would probably be sufficiently long to constitute a life sentence for him. This, below, is from the girl's testimony. (What the woman says now is irrelevant to the rape of a 13 year old, for a number of reasons. One, a speculative scenario I haven't seen raised (except by cynical me), is the possibility that she received in the past or does regularly a 'consideration' of some sort for adopting a forgiving attitude ... a gift... a compensatory gesture...an expression of regret... a token of esteem ... How surprising would it be if Polanski or some pal of his hadn't thought of doing such a thing, in anticipation of his current situation?) The questioning below begins after he gave her the champagne. Q: Did you take a quaalude? A: I took part of it. Q: Where did you get this part? A: [Polanski] gave it to me. [...] Q: After he kissed you did he say anything? A: No. Q: Did you say anything? A: No, besides I was just going, "No. Come on, let's go home." Q: What was said after you indicated that you wanted to go home when you were sitting on the couch? A: He said "I'll take you home soon." Q: Then what happened? A: Then he went down and he started performing cuddliness. Q: What does that mean? A: It means he went down on me or he placed his mouth on my vagina. [...] Q: What happened after that? A: He started to have intercourse with me. Q: What do you mean by intercourse? A: He placed his penis in my vagina. Q: What did you say, if anything, before he did that? A: I was mostly just on and off saying, "No, stop." But I wasn't fighting really because I, you know, there was no one else there and I had no place to go. Q: What did he say, if anything? A: He didn't answer me when I said, "No." [...] A: I think he said something like right after I said I was not on the pill, right before he said, "Oh, I won't come inside of you then." And I just went--and he goes--and then he put me--wait. Then he lifted my legs up farther and he went in through my anus. Q: When you say he went in your anus, what do you mean by that? A: He put his penis in my butt. Q: Did he say anything at that time? A: No. Q: Did you resist at that time? A: A little bit, but not really because--(pause.) Q: Because what? A: Because I was afraid of him. [...] Q: Do you know what a climax is? A: Yes. Q: Do you know whether he had a climax? A: Yes. Q: And how do you know that? A: Because I could kind of feel it and it was in my underwear. It was in my underwear. It was on my butt and stuff. Q: When you say that, you believe that he climaxed in your anus? A: Yes Whoopi refers to what Polanski did as "having sex with somebody." She never mentions the passivity and objections of the "somebody," a child, or the champagne and quaaludes, the oral sex, vaginal and anal penetration. Ick, Whoopi is disgusting.

To: epicure who wrote (122162)	10/4/2009 10:12:58 AM
From: greenspirit	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542214

Maybe it's because Hollywierd, which is a bastion of liberal activism, are defending the pedophile and have signed a petition to release him. Just a wild guess.... Tous les signataires de la pétition / All signing parties Erika Abrams, Fatih Akin, Yves Alberty, Stephane Allagnon, Woody Allen, Pedro Almodovar, Gianni Amelio, Wess Anderson, Michel Andrieu, Roger Andrieux, Jean-Jacques Annaud, Tomas Arana, Frédéric Aranzueque-Arrieta, Alexandre Arcady, Fanny Ardant, Asia Argento, Marie-Hélène Arnau, Darren Aronofsky, Olivier Assayas, Alexander Astruc, Gabriel Auer, Zdzicho Augustyniak, Alexandre Babel, Vladimir Bagrianski, Lubomila Bakardi, Fausto Nicolás Balbi, Eleonor Baldwin, Jean-François Balmer, Alberto Barbera Museo nazionale de Torino, Luc Barnier, Christophe Barratier, Ernest Barteldes, Carmen Bartl, Pascal Batigne, Anne Baudry, Juan Antonio Bayona, Xavier Beauvois, Liria Begeja, Matthieu Béguelin, Gilles Behat, Jean-Jacques Beineix, Marco Bellochio, Yannick Bellon, Florence Bellone, Monica Bellucci, Véra Belmont, Jacqueline Belon, Jean-Marc Benguigui, Djamel Bennecib, Luc Béraud, Jacob Berger, Alain Berliner, Gael Garcia Bernal, Pascal Berney, Xavier Berry, Bernardo Bertolucci, Giuseppe Bertolucci, Jean-Marie Besset, Marlène Bisson, Arnstein Bjørkly, Lucien Blacher, Virginie Blanc-Brude Bard, Jean-Marc Bloch, Léa Bloch, Catherine Boissière, Anne-Sylvie Bonaud, Olivier Bonnet, Thierry Boscheron, Renata Bosco, Freddy Bossy, Patrick Bouchitey, Cédric Bouchoucha, Paul Boujenah, Frédéric Bourboulon, Katia Boutin, Ian Brady, Jacques Bral, Sophie Bramly, Paulo Branco, Patrick Braoudé, Guila Braoudé, Edwin Brienen, Adrien Brody, Isabelle Broué, Max Brun, Merima Bruncevic, Anne Burki, André Buytaers, Emilie Buzyn, Anthony Byrne, Marco Cacioppo, Gerald Calderon, Monica Cannizzaro, Peggy Carajopoulou-Vavali, John Carchietta, Christian Carion, Henning Carlsen, Jean-Michel Carré, Esteban Carvajal Alegria, Lionel Cassan, Bryan Cassiday, Miss Catadler, Mathieu Celary, Teco Celio, Muriel Cerf, Dabiel Chabannes, Thierry Chabert, Chagi, Jean-Yves Chalangeas, Daniel Champagnon, Christophe Champclaux, Georges Chappedelaine , Fabienne Chauveau, Claire Chazal, Patrice Chéreau, Brigitte Chesneau, Michel Chevalier, Mishka Cheyko, Catherine Chiono, Catherine Chouchan, Elie Chouraqui, Elie Chouraqui, Souleymane Cissé, Jean- Pierre Clech, Henri Codenie, Robert Cohen, Catherine Colassin, Suzanne Colonna, Jean-Paul Commin, Anne Consigny, Alain Cophignon, Alain Corneau, Jérôme Cornuau, Guy Courtecuisse, Miguel Courtois, Antoine Courtray, Guillaume Cousin, Morgan Crestel, Rudyard Cretenet, Dominique Crevecoeur, Penelope Cruz, Alfonso Cuaron, Estelle Cywje, Frédéric Damien, Sophie Danon, Olivier Dard, Luc et Jean-Pierre Dardenne, Isabelle Dassonville, Bruno de Almeida, Bruno de Almeida, Marion de Blaÿ, François de Lamothe, Hervé de Luze, Artus de Penguern, Valérie de Saint-Do, Virginie De Wilde, Olivier Debert, Viviane Decuypere, Guillermo del Toro, Benoît Delmas, Michel Deloore, Jonathan Demme, Nicolaine den Breejen, Ruud den Dryver, Louisa Dent, Edwin Dervaux, Dante Desarthe, Romain Desbiens, Sophie Deschamps, Thomas Desjonquères, Alexandre Desplat, Chris Devi, Rosalinde et Michel Deville, Guillaume D'Ham, Christelle Didier, Kathrin DiPaola, Claire Dixsaut, Julien Doger, Xavier Dolan, Ariel Dorfman, Jean Douchet, Jean Douchet, Fabrice du Welz, Marina Duarte Nunes Ferreira, Danièle Dubroux, Marc Dufrenois, François Duhamel, Sissi Duparc, Jean Dusaussoy, Georges Dybman, Daniel Edinger, Arne Eickenberg, Yaniv Elani, Gerónimo Elortegui, Gerónimo Elortegui, Elrem, Sam Enoch, Peter Lucas Erixon, Ernest, Ann Eyckmans, Jacques Fansten, Joël Farges, Gianluca Farinelli (Cinémathèque de de Bologne), Etienne Faure, Maud et Romain Ferrari, Michel Ferry, Jean Teddy Filippe, Aurélie Fiorentino, Alan Fischer, Martine Fitoussi, Sebastian Fleischhacker, Joy Fleury., Michael Flynn, Hugues Fontenoy, Scott Foundas, Werner Fraai, Jean-Robert Franco, Stephen Frears, Marion Frelat, Thierry Frémaux, Marc Freycon, Nadine Fruchard, Sam Gabarski, Jean Francois Gaillard, René Gainville, Sara Gandolfi, Matteo Garone, Yves Gasser, Tony Gatlif, Catherine Gaudin-Montalto, Jean-Marc Gauthier, Costa Gavras, Nathalie Geiser, Lizi Gelber, Isabelle Gély, Jean-Marc Ghanassia, Alain Gil, Véronique Gillet, Terry Gilliam, Christian Gion, François Girault, Stéphane Gizard, Nelson Gonzalez, Carlos Miguel Bernardo González, Christophe Goumand, Michel Gras, Eric Gravereau, Martin Gregus, Thierry Grizard, Philippe Gruss, Florent Guézengar, Marc Guidoni, Marta Gutowska, Mikael Håfström, Ronald Harwood, Dimitri Haulet, Geert Heirbaut, Buck Henry, Nicole Herbaut de Lamothe, David Heyman, Laurent Heynemann, Joshua Highfield , Dominique Hollier, Isabelle Hontebeyrie, Frédéric Horiszny, Robert Hossein, Jean-Loup Hubert, Wendy Hudson, Alejandro Gonzalez Inarritu, Gilles Jacob, Eric et Veronique et Nicolas Jacquelin, Just Jaeckin, Thomas Jahn, Olivia Janik, Jean-Baptiste Jay, Anne Jeandet, Marie Jergan, Alain Jessua, Renate Jett, Sébastien Jimenez, Arthur Joffé, Pierre Jolivet, Kent Jones (World Cinema Foundation), Peter Josy, Alexandra Julen, Paola Jullian, Roger Kahane, Pierre Kalfon, Elisabeth Kalinowski, Reena Kanji, Nelly Kaplan, Wong Kar Waï, Nicolas Kermel, Darius Khondji, Ladislas Kijno, Muriel Kintziger, Richard Klebinder, Jonathan Klein, Harmony Korinne, Jan Kounen, Chantal Krakowski, Sylvia Kristel, Diane Kurys, Elzbieta Kusak-Majchrzak, Emir Kusturica, Irene Kuznetzova, Jean Labadie, Eliane Lacroux, Eric Lagesse, Michel Laigle, Stéphane Lam, John Landis, Claude Lanzmann, David Lanzmann, André Larquié, Pauline Larrieu, Jacques et Françoise Lassalle, Marc Latil, Carole Laure, Christine Laurent-Blixen, Pierre Laville, Emilien Lazaron, Eric Le Roy, Pierre Le Scouarnec, Fábio Leal, Vinciane Lecocq, Patrice Leconte, Linda Lefebvre, Béatrice Lefoulon, Delphine Legros, Claude Lelouch, Ann Lemonnier, Julieta Lencina, Alain Lenglet, Gérard Lenne, Les Nanaqui, Larry Levine, Charlotte Levy, Lorraine Lévy, Pierre et Renée Lhomme, Katarzyna Lipinska, Jean-Claude Irving Longin, Marceline Loridan-Ivens, Michael Louis Wells, Boris Loundine, Rachel Lowenstein, Catalina Lozano, Hugo Luczyc-Wyhowski, Flore Luquet, Laurence Lustyk, David Lynch, Bania Madjbar, Krzysztof Majchrzak, Laurent Malet, Tim Malieckal, Guy Malugani, Erling Mandelmann, Michael Mann, Yvon Marciano, François Margolin, Jean-Pierre Marois, Tonie Marshall, Alain Martin, Sandrine Martin, Danielle Martinetti, Florent Martinez, Didier Martiny, Mario Martone, Thierry Mathelin, Christine Mathis, Esmeralda Mattei, Nicolas Mauvernay, Yannick Mazet, Christopher, Spencer et Claire Mc Andrew, Natalie Mei, Guillermo Menaldi, Mathieu Mercier, Muriel Mercier, Frédéric Mermoud, Laura Metaxa, Allison Michel, Radu Mihaileanu, Jean-Louis Milesi, Claude Miller, Lionel Miniato, Nelly Moaligou, Jean - Marc Modeste , Mario Monicelli, Jeanne Moreau, Frédéric Moreau, Sarah Moreau-Flament, Gael Morel, Omayra Muñiz Fernández, Stephanie Murat, Christian Mvogo Mbarga, Anna N.Levine, Charles Nemes, Juliette Nicolas-Donnard, Sandra Nicolier, Rachel Noël, Rui 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Joubert, Marc Obéron, Michel Ocelot, David Ogando, Mariana Oliveira Santos, Szentgyörgyi Ottó, Martine Pagès, Eric Pape, Abner Pastoll, Alexander Payne, Nicola Pecorini, Richard Pena (Directeur Festival de NY), Lindsey Pence, Olivier Père, Suzana Peric, Jacques Perrin, Cesare Petrillo, Thomas Pibarot, Michel Piccoli, Arnaud Pierrichon, Stéphane Pietri, Anne Pigeon Bormans, Samuel Pinon, Claude Pinoteau, Michele Placido, Sabrina Poidevin, Agnès Catherine Poirier, Jean-Yves Potel, Stéphane Pozderec, Harry Prenger, Jean et Marie Prévost, Gilbert Primet, Marie-Hélène Raby, Philippe Radault, Tristan Rain, Florence Raphaël, Florence Raphel, Jean-Paul Rappeneau, Joseph Rassam, Rolandas Rastauskas, Brett Ratner, Raphael Rebibo, Carol Reid, Jo Reymen, Laurence Reymond, Yasmina Reza, Christiane Rhein, Jacques Richard, Dominique Robert, Margarita Robski, Jean-Jacques Rochut, Christian Rogler, Yannick Rolandeau, Paul Rondags, Avital Ronell, Frank Roozendaal, Graciela Rosato, Elisabeth Roudinesco, Kontochristopoulou Roula, Laurence Roulet, Joshua Rout, Paolo Roversi, Isabelle Ruh, Martin Ruhe, Sonia Rykiel, Anita S. Chang, Esteban S. Goffin, JOAQUÍN Sabina, Marc Saffar, Ludivine Sagnier, Gabriela Salazar Scherman, Walter Salles, Jean-Paul Salomé, Jean-Frédéric Samie, Marc Sandberg, Léo Scalpel, Jerry Schatzberg, Richard Schlesinger, Daniel Schmidt, Georg Schmithüsen, Julian Schnabel, Pierre Schoendoerffer, Barbet Schroeder, J. Neil Schulman, Pierre Schumacher, Pierre-Alexandre Schwab, Ettore Scola, Luis Gustavo Sconza Zaratin Soares, Martin Scorsese, Carole Scotta, Steven Sedgwick, Andrea Sedlackova, Frank Segier, Michèle Seguin-Sirhugue, Guy Seligmann, Elis Semczuk, Lorenzo Semple Jr, Julien Seri, Joël Séria, Catherine Sermet, Ken Seton-Vyhnal, Sophie Sharkov, Boris Shlafer, Antoine Silber, Pierre Silvant, Charlotte Silvera, Noel Simsolo, Christophe Sirodeau, Abderrahmane Sissako, Beatrice Sisul , Petter Skavlan, Marcin Sokolowski, Loïc Sorel, Paolo Sorrentino, Vassilis Sourapas, Roch Stephanik, Karen Stetler, Denise Stieglitz, Guillaume Stirn, Bernard Stora, Gérard Stum, Jean-Marc Surcin, Tilda Swinton, Piotrek Szymanek, Jean-Charles Tacchella, Radovan Tadic, Mickael Tanguy, Danis Tanovic, Bertrand Tavernier, André Techiné, Cécile Telerman, Harold Alvarado Tenorio, Marie-Ange Terrier, Alain Terzian, Christian Texier, Jean-Paul Thaens, Valentine Theret, Virginie Thévenet, Pascal Thomas, Jeremy Thomas, Marc Thomas Charley, Cyril Thurston, Giuseppe Tornatore, Serge Toubiana, Daniel Treichler, Nadine Trintignant, Julie Turcas, Mitja Tušek, Tom Tykwer, Alexandre Tylski, Stephen Ujlaki, José Antonio Valdés Peña, Jaques Vallotton, Phil van der Linden, Betrand van Effenterre, Leopold van Genechten, Christophe van Rompaey, Dorna van Rouveroy, Elbert van Strien, Vangelis, Alessio Vannetti, Lucília Verdelho da Costa, Christian Verdu, Jean-Pierre Vergne, Sarah Vermande, Julien Veyret, Francesco Vezzoli, Régine Vial, Vivien Villani, Marc Villemain, Jean-François Villemer, Daria Vinault, Verde Visconti, Alain Vorimore, Thomas Vossart, Gilles Walusinski, Eric Watton, Monika Weibel, Dominique Welinski, Wim Wenders, Andy Whittaker, Anaïse Wittmann, A Wolanin, Margot Wolfs, Peter Woltil, Arnaud Xainte, Steve Yeo, Paule Zajdermann, Christian Zeender, Terry Zwigoff. sacd.fr

To: epicure who wrote (122162)	10/4/2009 10:31:47 AM
From: slacker711	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 542214

WHO is defending this guy aside from show biz types who think his art is a defense to a crime I dont think there are many in this country that are defending him (beyond the show biz types you mention). However, some of the initial comments from Europe were simply unbelievable. A French minister talked about how this was the "scary face" of America. Lech Walesa said something about forgiving his only sin. I read quite a few others as well that reflected a thinking that I find to be incomprehensible. Personally though, this isnt a liberal/conservative split but an illustration of how big the cultural gap is between the US and Europe. Those comments might not represent all of Europe but they are widespread enough that politicians dont seem to have a problem saying them aloud. The vast majority of time I understand why Europeans thinks the way they do, even when I disagree...but in this case, the thinking is as foreign as the stoning for adultery cases you still occasionally hear about. The fact that so many Hollywood liberals are defending him just shows how out of touch they are with their own country. Slacker