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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: denizen48 who wrote (126161)	12/3/2009 12:19:05 AM
From: Wharf Rat	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 542160

Uh, he told us he was gonna put more troops into Afghan. Maybe you missed that. It's pretty hard to correct 30 years (or maybe double that, even) in 11 months. Even harder when not one R will go along with the program; worse; throwing up every hurdle in the world. Yer living in a dream world if you think he has a magic wand that will make the last 30 years go away in a year. Do you seriously think there is one person in the entire world who can make the R's just sit down and not stall? Do you think he is a king who can do what he wants? Do you think the Dems will suddenly vote in mindless lockstep when they have never done that in their history? Not Civil Rights, Not Medicare, not even SS socialsecurity.gov Teddy Roosevelt proposed Medicare for all in 1912, and yer upset cuz O hasn't done it in 11 months? Get real. Come back and see us when you have convinced the Senate that 50+1 is the majority. Here's a thought...would you like him to issue signing statements and make some recess appointments to further your goals?

To: denizen48 who wrote (126161)	12/3/2009 9:09:29 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 542160

Our alternative was McCain- you think he would have been better? For me, a true liberal, there really was no question that Obama would be the best choice. I have no idea what centrists really want- they are all over the map. But for a liberal, McCain was guaranteed to be worse, in just about every way. So I continue to be pleased. I did not expect major changes- I just wanted a liberal tilt, and good supreme court nominees. I'm happy with the more activist FDA, and I'm pleased with the less adversarial international "face" we are projecting. Would I like to pull out of Afghanistan now? And Iraq? You bet. Would it be wise to do that? I've no idea- haven't seen the data Obama sees. But I have much more confidence that Obama would make a decision on data which I could trust, than that McCain would. I think it takes more spine to stand up to your friends than it does to stand up to the people who hate you and who will always hate you. Those people really are a zero, since they just don't matter and can never be won over- no point in trying- so imo, Obama's decision on the war took a lot of spine, imo. The easy thing to do would have been to pull out and please all of "us"- those of us who want out, NOW. The fact that he did not do that makes me think there must be some significant reasons for a more prolonged stay.