SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Gold/Mining/Energy : Big Dog's Boom Boom Room -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: LoneClone who wrote (156614)9/7/2011 8:05:37 PM
From: Bearcatbob18 Recommendations  Respond to of 206114
 
Mr. Clone - refresh my mind as to the energy investment ideas you came here to share?
I would submit we need ideas - not just readers. Last I knew - Big does not make money on page views.

And lord knows - you would never bring up the subject of politics.

Bob



To: LoneClone who wrote (156614)9/7/2011 11:01:41 PM
From: kollmhn23 Recommendations  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 206114
 
"I am out of here."

Good news ! And..............don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.



To: LoneClone who wrote (156614)9/8/2011 1:45:53 AM
From: whitepine7 Recommendations  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 206114
 
LoneCone "BTW, whenever I called you guys on your garbage I always got a bunch of e-mails from lurkers who are equally appalled. Why you guys insist on driving away potential readers is beyond me, but I guess you like it that way."

===================

And whenever we've called you out....you ran away. LOL

Emails from fellow tree-hugging lurkers? Why would they be interested in oil/gas companies or profits? Better for them to 'invest' in the Pembina Institute and sell David Suzuki-Leni
Riefenstahl
DVD's on street corners in Vancouver.

FYI...from today's WSJ

The Other Climate Theory Al Gore won't hear it, but heavenly bodies might be driving long-term weather trends.


By ANNE JOLIS In April 1990, Al Gore published an open letter in the New York Times "To Skeptics on Global Warming" in which he compared them to medieval flat-Earthers. He soon became vice president and his conviction that climate change was dominated by man-made emissions went mainstream. Western governments embarked on a new era of anti-emission regulation and poured billions into research that might justify it. As far as the average Western politician was concerned, the debate was over.

But a few physicists weren't worrying about Al Gore in the 1990s. They were theorizing about another possible factor in climate change: charged subatomic particles from outer space, or "cosmic rays," whose atmospheric levels appear to rise and fall with the weakness or strength of solar winds that deflect them from the earth. These shifts might significantly impact the type and quantity of clouds covering the earth, providing a clue to one of the least-understood but most important questions about climate. Heavenly bodies might be driving long-term weather trends.

The theory has now moved from the corners of climate skepticism to the center of the physical-science universe: the European Organization for Nuclear Research, also known as CERN. At the Franco-Swiss home of the world's most powerful particle accelerator, scientists have been shooting simulated cosmic rays into a cloud chamber to isolate and measure their contribution to cloud formation. CERN's researchers reported last month that in the conditions they've observed so far, these rays appear to be enhancing the formation rates of pre-cloud seeds by up to a factor of 10. Current climate models do not consider any impact of cosmic rays on clouds.

Scientists have been speculating on the relationship among cosmic rays, solar activity and clouds since at least the 1970s. But the notion didn't get a workout until 1995, when Danish physicist Henrik Svensmark came across a 1991 paper by Eigil Friis-Christensen and Knud Lassen, who had charted a close relationship between solar variations and changes in the earth's surface temperature since 1860.

"I had this idea that the real link could be between cloud cover and cosmic rays, and I wanted to try to figure out if it was a good idea or a bad idea," Mr. Svensmark told me from Copenhagen, where he leads sun-climate research at the Danish National Space Institute.

He wasn't the first scientist to have the idea, but he was the first to try to demonstrate it. He got in touch with Mr. Friis-Christensen, and they used satellite data to show a close correlation among solar activity, cloud cover and cosmic-ray levels since 1979.

They announced their findings, and the possible climatic implications, at a 1996 space conference in Birmingham, England. Then, as Mr. Svensmark recalls, "everything went completely crazy. . . . It turned out it was very, very sensitive to say these things already at that time." He returned to Copenhagen to find his local daily leading with a quote from the then-chair of the U.N. Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC): "I find the move from this pair scientifically extremely naïve and irresponsible."

Mr. Svensmark had been, at the very least, politically naïve. "Before 1995 I was doing things related to quantum fluctuations. Nobody was interested, it was just me sitting in my office. It was really an eye-opener, that baptism into climate science." He says his work was "very much ignored" by the climate-science establishment—but not by CERN physicist Jasper Kirkby, who is leading today's ongoing cloud-chamber experiment.

On the phone from Geneva, Mr. Kirkby says that Mr. Svensmark's hypothesis "started me thinking: There's good evidence that pre-industrial climate has frequently varied on 100-year timescales, and what's been found is that often these variations correlate with changes in solar activity, solar wind. You see correlations in the atmosphere between cosmic rays and clouds—that's what Svensmark reported. But these correlations don't prove cause and effect, and it's very difficult to isolate what's due to cosmic rays and what's due to other things."

In 1997 he decided that "the best way to settle it would be to use the CERN particle beam as an artificial source of cosmic rays and reconstruct an artificial atmosphere in the lab." He predicted to reporters at the time that, based on Mr. Svensmark's paper, the theory would "probably be able to account for somewhere between a half and the whole" of 20th-century warming. He gathered a team of scientists, including Mr. Svensmark, and proposed the groundbreaking experiment to his bosses at CERN.

Then he waited. It took six years for CERN to greenlight and fund the experiment. Mr. Kirkby cites financial pressures for the delay and says that "it wasn't political."

Mr. Svensmark declines entirely to guess why CERN took so long, noting only that "more generally in the climate community that is so sensitive, sometimes science goes into the background."

By 2002, a handful of other scientists had started to explore the correlation, and Mr. Svensmark decided that "if I was going to be proved wrong, it would be nice if I did it myself." He decided to go ahead in Denmark and construct his own cloud chamber. "In 2006 we had our first results: We had demonstrated the mechanism" of cosmic rays enhancing cloud formation. The IPCC's 2007 report all but dismissed the theory.

Mr. Kirkby's CERN experiment was finally approved in 2006 and has been under way since 2009. So far, it has not proved Mr. Svensmark wrong. "The result simply leaves open the possibility that cosmic rays could influence the climate," stresses Mr. Kirkby, quick to tamp down any interpretation that would make for a good headline.

This seems wise: In July, CERN Director General Rolf-Dieter Heuer told Die Welt that he was asking his researchers to make the forthcoming cloud-chamber results "clear, however, not to interpret them. This would go immediately into the highly political arena of the climate-change debate."

But while the cosmic-ray theory has been ridiculed from the start by those who subscribe to the anthropogenic-warming theory, both Mr. Kirkby and Mr. Svensmark hold that human activity is contributing to climate change. All they question is its importance relative to other, natural factors.

Through several more years of "careful, quantitative measurement" at CERN, Mr. Kirkby predicts he and his team will "definitively answer the question of whether or not cosmic rays have a climatically significant effect on clouds." His old ally Mr. Svensmark feels he's already answered that question, and he guesses that CERN's initial results "could have been achieved eight to 10 years ago, if the project had been approved and financed."

The biggest milestone in last month's publication may be not the content but the source, which will be a lot harder to ignore than Mr. Svensmark and his small Danish institute.

Any regrets, now that CERN's particle accelerator is spinning without him? "No. It's been both a blessing and the opposite," says Mr. Svensmark. "I had this field more or less to myself for years—that would never have happened in other areas of science, such as particle physics. But this has been something that most climate scientists would not be associated with. I remember another researcher saying to me years ago that the only thing he could say about cosmic rays and climate was it that it was a really bad career move."

On that point, Mr. Kirkby—whose organization is controlled by not one but 20 governments—really does not want to discuss politics at all: "I'm an experimental particle physicist, okay? That somehow nature may have decided to connect the high-energy physics of the cosmos with the earth's atmosphere—that's what nature may have done, not what I've done."

Last month's findings don't herald the end of a debate, but the resumption of one. That is, if the politicians purporting to legislate based on science will allow it.



To: LoneClone who wrote (156614)9/8/2011 4:31:46 PM
From: ChanceIs7 Recommendations  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 206114
 
RE: Enviro-Nazis

Lone Clone pmailed me regarding what he deems to be my altogether too loose usage/association of the word "Nazi" with anything other than mass murders, and in this instance an unwarranted berating of the environmental movement. I have no problem with LC's position regarding my usage. I had contemplated composing a long defense, but I will simply plead that "everybody else is doing it," and cite the Urban Dictionary:

1. enviro-nazi


n. an environmentalist who is so anal over the cause that he or she feels it it entirely ok to trample on the rights of others to enforce his beliefs.
Most of these morons are ultra-left liberal flakes with no career ambitions or direction, but still need to find ways to keep others down in a futile attempt to elevate themselves. Many are also PETA members and all have socialist agendas.

Enviro-nazi examples are everywhere, from the bicyclists who occasionally stage a rally to block major bridges in rush hour in a vain attempt to blackmail normal people into giving up their cars to the protesters who turn up in droves with signs and attitude whenever they get word that somebody somewhere intends to cut down a tree or drill for oil.

I suppose that Nazis in general got their rocks off killing other people - or perhaps just watching other people die en masse. Under the latter interpretation, one might suggest that Jim Jones of Guyana/Jonestown/Kool-Aid fame was a Nazi. He induced mass suicide - albeit at gun point. If Al Gore got his way - and forced the US completely off of coal by 2015 - then I would guess that he would have persuaded some 20 million to commit suicide by living in unheated houses all winter long.

PS: One can even find Enviro-Nazi quotes. A few: (Query for the board: Is rural cleaning like ethnic cleansing?)

Enviro-Nazi Quotes

Rural Cleansing

Posted on Friday, June 14, 2002 2:30:13 PM by Tailgunner Joe

"We have got to share this planet with the other living creatures, and sharing means not merely preserving them in zoos or National Parks, but setting aside huge areas. Whole regions perhaps that will be free of human interference. Ideally, I would like to see certain large areas of the planet set off-limits to human entry of any kind, even aerial over flights."

-Edward Abbey-Deep Ecology for the 21st Century: The Natural Wonder: An Ecocentric World View. New Dimensions Radio, 1998.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The only hope of the Earth is to withdraw huge areas as inviolate natural sanctuaries from the depredations of modern industry and technology. Move out the people and cars. Reclaim the roads and the plowed lands."

-Dave Foreman, Confessions of an Eco-Warrior

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"At first glance, a vision of North America with regained wildness and biodiversity seems unrealistic, even utopian. But when we consider that restoration at this scale is a process requiring decades or even centuries, it begins to make sense."

-Noss and Cooperrider, 1994, "Saving Natures Legacy, Protecting and Restoring Biodiversity." Island Press, Washington, D.C.)

freerepublic.com

______________________________________________________

PPS:

'This used to be a Pizza Hut, now it's all covered with daises,

I caught a rattlesnake, now I have something for dinner

I miss the honky-tonks, Dairy Queens and 7-Elevens,

and as things fell apart, nobody paid much attention.'


Talking Heads - Nothing but Flowers - circa 1987

youtube.com