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Politics : Evolution -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Brumar89 who wrote (34257)	3/16/2013 2:49:11 PM
From: Solon	1 Recommendation Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 69300

"Dawkins said: "With respect to those meanings of "human" that are relevant to the morality of abortion, any fetus is less human than an adult pig." Of course he is 100% correct. Scientists tend to know a bit more than superstitious buffoons! A developed pig is far more "human" than a fetus as it regards any sentience or concurrent value. Pigs are even very close to humans in other ways: "The anatomy of a pig and a human are very similar. Both are placental mammal, which means the fetus receives nourishment from the mother through the umbilical cord. Both species are also omnivores. These two things lead to the digestive track and layers under the skin to be similar. Both have complex systems that allow nutrients and dissolved gases to enter and leave individual cells throughout the body. Basically the internal cavity of the pig is very similar to that of a human, it is only smaller. The heart is located at the same place, between the lungs, the liver and a gall bladder look almost like the humans, and the whole digestive system is extremely similar to humans' digestive system. Thought pigs and humans are similar there are still some differences. One of the major differences is the facial expression; the pigs have bigger ear, they also have a tail. Also pigs have different feet, position and number of toes on their feet." That is just simple science. Not a big deal. Pigs are smarter than some humans. They are smarter and more sentient than ALL fetuses. Do we value fetuses more than pigs in spite of these differences? Well...yes and no. It depends on the value we put on each. So, if you VALUE any fetus more than any pig, the next step is simple. There are millions of fetuses all over the world which will be aborted in a short time. Let us pick North Korea--OK?? If you have 500 pigs, then you can trade them for 500 fetuses (brought to term, I assume)! IF YOU DO THAT YOU WILL HAVE CREDIBILITY ON THIS AND ALL THREADS. IF YOU DO NOT, THEN YOU ARE JUST A MOUTHPIECE BABBLING STUFF YOU ARE CLUELESS ABOUT.

To: Brumar89 who wrote (34257)	3/16/2013 10:19:55 PM
From: 2MAR$	2 Recommendations Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

To say that there's a living sentient being in the embryonic stages is a complete wasted argument for the sake of supporting some sub rational 19th century Roman Catholic theological mental epilepsy. No women of faith but sound minds today takes the idiot's ban on contraceptives seriously, at least not the greater majority of women in most all advanced countries . (tells you alot about that in itself, speaks a 100 volumes but you have only a cut n paste mind) Every indication now regarding the beginning of human life informs us that conception is obviousy not in the early stages but an extended process of formation in the womb. The ability to live outside the womb or viability, is usually placed at 28wks ( or 7mos) and the common wisdom dating back to Aristotle & the God's living OT was generally almost always assigned "animated" personhood not until live birth outside the womb.

To: Brumar89 who wrote (34257)	3/16/2013 10:53:37 PM
From: 2MAR$	1 Recommendation Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 69300

The discussion of pain & comparison to pigs the professor could have framed it better but if you half the length of viability to 12wks or less , in terms of developement & sentience he's being quite accurate. When it comes to determining & estimating what possible pain such an early fetus would feel i would go and always put the major bulk of emphasis on what the educated specialists that spent years in practice would say over hysteria creating nimrods like yourself. Since also growing up with horses, ranch country & ranchers saw many instances of real life pain from bloody birth to 1000's of brandings, to bullet in the head. There's humane & not humane , with many changes adopted in the last 50yrs regarding animal husbandry which are the good signs of growth of awareness. Just simple facts such as animals experiencing some fear & anxiety just like ourselves. Never knew ranchers here that were not loving but naturally humane & understanding, who treated their animals well.