SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Politics : Manmade Global Warming, A hoax? A Scam? or a Doomsday Cult? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Don Hurst who wrote (3798)2/13/2014 5:00:06 PM
From: sense1 Recommendation

Recommended By
Maurice Winn

  Respond to of 4326
 
The planet WAS warming up.

It is known (settled science) that that is what typically happens at the end of an ice age.
It's also known (settled science) that that is what typically happens with increased solar activity.

It is known that both conditions were true of that period when warming clearly was occurring...

When "should" we expect to see change occur ? How should it occur, then ? Science doesn't know.

It seems reasonable, if climate is getting warmer, that the water might get warmer as a part of that... without that doing anything to alter the REST of what's required in the PROCESS OF REASON... that defines science. An observation "the water is getting warmer" doesn't prove why, how, or whether or not it should.

What you posted, though, makes no sense at all...

The planet's temperature is not remaining steady


IT ISN'T SUPPOSED TO.


and it certainly isn't cooling


THE DATA SAY IT IS.


Earth, especially its ocean, are heating up… and rapidly. Which is why: a new study shows that the detectable slowdown of global surface temperature increases over the last fifteen years ?


That language is fraudulent... that claims a "slowdown" of increases... is evidence of "heating up... rapidly". If you can't trust the reason applied in their language in simple facts... that is a proof that you should not trust their reason in complicated facts.


The science is a FRAUD... not only because their predictions have failed. That predictions have failed... proves the science is NOT settled... and their theory everything else is based on... doesn't work. Denying the truth of that... requires fraud... and, the fact of fraud is proven in many other instances as well... including falsifying data, coordinating "review", etc.


Tacking on one new instance of "something else we didn't know before" that we think we've learned now... doesn't obviate the fact of being wrong, rather than proving it ?


And, then... "a trend that climate change denialists have seized on to foment doubt among the general public."

Incorrect, re "change denialists". Because only the "advocates" are claiming (obviously wrongly) that climate shouldn't ever change... so that any change occurring is bad, and a reason to try to terrify people... and seize political control of the economy ?

Correct, re fomenting doubt. Because when your science is proven wrong... and is proven to be based in fraud, and about advocacy, not truth... people SHOULD doubt that you are honest, and your opinion correct.

Change... happens. That's a fact... not a prediction. That fact makes any project based in the assumption that change shouldn't happen... one based in fallacy. From there, it's not that you "can't handle the truth"... it's that you can't GET TO the truth.

WHY change occurs... isn't known... and proof requires ACTUAL SCIENCE... not making crap up as you go along, because you think it might be plausible enough to convince the public ?

It is fraud for any scientist to claim they know WHY change is occurring, or why it is occurring AS it is...

When the fraud stops... THEN we'll be able to make better progress in finding the truth. Until then, the RISK being imposed... is being imposed by those perpetrating fraud... and those enabling them in doing so.

If the planet fries to a crisp and we all die in the next 50 years because of runaway climate effects... the blame for that will reside in those who lacked scientific rigor and scientific integrity...

The reason people doubt scientists opinions now... is because they are RIGHT to doubt them.

And that toleration of fraud continues... is no reason to think about trusting them...

The fact they continue learning... seems obvious as a proof they didn't already know it all before ? Claiming they DO know it all when they don't IS THE PROBLEM.

This is not rocket science... and, in fact, it isn't science at all... but OBVIOUS basic reason... where it intersects with social science. When you lie to people... they quit believing you.

Science DOES NOT have the answers. Claiming they do... is FRAUD.

As far as "a false sense of temperature stability when the reality is very much the opposite"...

What is false... is to claim temperature SHOULD be stable. It never has been. It never will be. Change is normal. When science isn't far enough along that it can't tell you what normal is... or why normal change happens... they can't tell you what isn't normal ? And, when science is so obviously wrong as to claim "change" shouldn't happen ?

Otherwise, as before... science doesn't understand it... but, no matter how much science does understand, we understand enough to know that a steady state with a LACK of change... is not normal...

Change is not necessarily bad. Which does not mean change is good ? But, change happens.

What to do about it ? The validity of the assumption we SHOULD "do something about the weather"... as an entering argument ? Every element of the "debate" appears structured to enable authorization for "doing something"... when there appears no valid justification for even considering "doing something"... much less without carefully considering WHAT... and WHO we should trust with WHAT ?

The "science is settled"... only because they don't want there to be any honest debate about "what to do" or "who is legitimately allowed to decide"...

I think you can't trust anyone who is a science whore... who is paid to flog the policy, not apply reason.

So, I think you should ignore any article that doesn't start with "I'm not a science or whore, or a policy marketing whore, and my work shows"... ?



To: Don Hurst who wrote (3798)2/13/2014 7:07:12 PM
From: Bill  Respond to of 4326
 
-26 in Barrow today. Not much ice melting in that weather.
There's no denying it.



To: Don Hurst who wrote (3798)2/13/2014 7:40:58 PM
From: sense6 Recommendations

Recommended By
Bill
d[-_-]b
FJB
greenspirit
J.B.C.

and 1 more member

  Respond to of 4326
 
"Just amazing how politically partisan you right wing deniers of science"...

First, the "deniers of science"... are the ones trying foist FRAUD on you, while calling it science... while doing back flips in the effort to avoid ANY application of the most BASIC tests of logic and reason... to the crap they're pushing.

I AM a scientist... who will gladly deny that "making shit up" is science.

I am NOT a "science whore"... or a marketing focused policy advocate or media hack with a salary based on pay to play... who will say whatever... without regard to the truth... as long the team likes it.

The truth is... a lot of scientists are lying. That they're ABLE to do that, as easily as they are... is a reason for you to be concerned about larger systems issues, like the state of education... and the health of the institution of science as a function of a failing education system... and liberal derangement syndrome... while you see "science" proving unable to keep its high priests from drooling in public.

And, there is a cost associated with that devolution. The obvious costs include spending way too much for way too little in real results... as, anytime you pay people to tell you what you want to hear to sustain funding... you shouldn't expect "truth" rather than more of what you want to hear... even when its wrong ? Other costs... include reputational damage, when actual truth being accidentally revealed, in spite of your efforts to hide it... also means you are revealed as the frauds and whores you are ? Science is being grossly damaged by the institutional FOSTERING, much less tolerance, of malpractice.

I insist science must be a process based in reason... that proceeds from the formulation of a RANGE of valid questions to a search for valid answers... which search MUST be conducted WITHOUT BIAS on the part of observers in regard to what the answer "must be"... and science must NOT be allowed to become a process of selecting answers, first, based in things other than science, and then allocating massive resources to defending them at all costs... which is fraud. Is there ANY aspect in this debate... that suggests the effort in "the science" is being fostered in a way that works to isolate it from BIAS ? Those responsible for eliminating bias... which is integral to sustaining integrity... are the ones requiring the bias ? Science... has failed... and, the failure you see in the RESULT... is merely an indication of the failure of the institution.

It is revealing of your own ignorance, though, that you choose to show you are another liberal partisan who is also an intolerant bigot... a religious bigot... apparently too stupid to understand that science and religion are in no way incompatible... and (in spite of the religious or scientific reasoning errors of any human) NEVER can be. That isn't a claim any religious OR scientific infallibility exists, rather than the opposite... but it (science and religion are in no way incompatible) is true by definition in relation to the logic of the structure of reason, as reason is applied in generating the LIMITS that define science... which limits do not apply in other forms of reasoning. Science only works because it is narrowly LIMITED in its logical structure... the limits narrowing the range in what science CAN apply to... and thus science CAN have nothing to say... EVER... about things that ARE outside of its comprehension, which is limited by its own structure.

Science has less to say, and can say anything it does only with less authority... than any other religion... because, as a religion... science is the only one wearing a blindfold... while reading the eye chart.

If you are depending on science to give you answers about things like humanity, morality, spirituality, God, love, family, community, freedom, justice, law... you need to have your head examined.

That I'm here lambasting the obvious and basic failures in reasoning apparent in "science" now... doesn't seem to provide you with a reason to suspect I'd support flawed reasoning... anywhere else ? Your error.

The irony, of course, is that much of the problem being identified here... results precisely from what you appear to demonstrate... in a RELIGIOUS belief in the infallibility of science (in spite of reason disallowing that)... which infallibility it is supposed to sustain, somehow, while the process we see fostering that fervent belief... fails entirely in adhering to ITS OWN most obvious basic tenets of reason ?

What we see here today... are obviously fallacious arguments being advanced... as proofs that science is infallible... and obviously, that means those (sadly, few) who CAN identify fraud when they see it in the structure of an argument... must be the ones who are irrational ? LOL!!

As far as my political bias... I'm against making stupidity the basis of public policy.

Obamacare... is stupid. It is the KIND of stupid... that requires only working at putting square pegs in round holes... in spite of having plenty of round pegs. It appears the only real consequences of the entire thing... are "unintended". It is the same... in terms of origins... being wholly based in (Obama et al) assuming they understood how things work, when they very clearly didn't, and still don't...

If you are NOT AT ALL surprised by the obvious failure... you are of at least average intelligence...
If you are or ever were SURPRISED it isn't working as advertised... well, "not".
If you are "SHOCKED, SHOCKED"... you are Nancy Pelosi.

It is FACT that same process of denial you see being practiced, now, in relation to the failure of the fraud that has been practiced in global warming science... is easily recognizable in the patterns of behavior you see emerging in relation to the failure of Obamacare... Same process, tactics, etc. The most remarkable thing about the politics of it, though, is that the Democrats KNEW that it wouldn't work when they put it together... and they gladly went along with it anyway...

Apparently... some liberals have a lemming gene...

People aren't particularly innovative... in how they deal with being stupid... or having that be proven. One obvious approach... is dilution, so that by failing en mass, at least no one will blame you individually ? Belonging to a "team" that defines your political thought... for you... is a labor saving device... that means you don't have think about stuff much, or deeply, but just parrot the party line. Still a good idea to be aware... there ARE risks in that method... worth avoiding. So, parties may be good fun, and simplify life, but, avoiding Jim Jones Kool-aide parties... is still worth doing.

When Republicans ARE being as stupid as Democrats and inflicting damage on themselves and others along with them... I'll be glad to point that out, as I have often enough in the past. For now, they appear mostly to be doing nothing... while allowing Democrats to fail... taking everyone else down with them. For, now, the D's appear to have patented a new method that requires sustaining a far more potent form of stupidity for a much longer time, after it has proven itself toxic... and that looks wildly and dangerously dysfunctional, to me.



To: Don Hurst who wrote (3798)2/13/2014 7:50:51 PM
From: Thomas A Watson  Respond to of 4326
 
Don, you do not understand. Man generated CO2 is causing global warming is the same as saying if you like your doctor or medical plan you can keep them under Obamanation Care.

Any way, I just got done using my gasoline powered frozen green house gas blower moving 8 inches of frozen green house gas. Now It can absorb some heat and take it somewhere else down the yellow brick road.

Current prediction is for 1 to 4 more inches of frozen green house gas over night. I think Jerry Brown has put out a curse so no liquid or solid green house gas will fall in California.

49 states with frozen green house gas on the ground. Whose da man responsible for all that frozen green house gas.



To: Don Hurst who wrote (3798)2/14/2014 12:06:29 PM
From: longnshort3 Recommendations

Recommended By
Hawkmoon
J.B.C.
weatherguru

  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 4326
 

NWS: Mid-Atlantic Storm 9th Biggest Ever Recorded...
SNOW IN 49 STATES...
Great Lakes ice breakers exhausted...
Thousands Without Power...
Residents Cook Food In Fireplaces...
100-car pile-up on PA turnpike...
Philly Snowfall Shatters 130-Year-Old Record...

and you think a little warming is bad, wait until the next Ice age and you will see billions die in just a few years, not oh oh the oceans are gonna go up 5 inches in a 100 fukking years



To: Don Hurst who wrote (3798)2/14/2014 1:48:48 PM
From: longnshort  Respond to of 4326
 
‘Unthinking Climate Change Worship Harming Britain’ UK Energy Minister Warns 8 cfp