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Technology Stocks : MSFT Internet Explorer vs. NSCP Navigator -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: John Donahoe who wrote (16458)	1/20/1998 8:20:00 PM
From: Daniel Schuh	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 24154

Gilette gives their razors away so you will buy their blades. Another tired old saw. Gilette bundles various blade holders together with their blades. Do you have any evidence that Gilette currently or in the past ever actually "gave away razors" as a matter of course? that is, handed out the blade carriers, free of charge, with no concurrent purchase involved? They may have done that sometime in the past, I don't know, but I've never seen such a thing in my lifetime. Maybe isolated "free after rebate"/free sample things, but not like the popular story goes. The consent decree and the bundling issue only applies to separate products, not integrated functions. IE is an integrated function. Uh huh. And would you care to define "integrated function"? As distinct from "tied product" or "bundled product"? Presumably, it's one of those ham sandwich things, what Microsoft says is integrated, is integrated. Or do you have a more substantial definition in mind? The nature of capitalism is competition. As a result there will be winners and losers. Right. The nature of our system of government is to accept the rule of law, or pay the consequences. It's not up to philosophers of "capitalism", whatever that word means, to say what the rules business es are to operate under. Microsoft presumably has no problem using the courts to enforce its contracts. Microsoft has no problem getting the President to send envoys over to your favorite overseas market to try to get them to create and obey something like the laws we agree to live by here wrt "intellectual property". But somehow, the very idea of compliance with antitrust law is beyond the pale here. So, here's another question. Remember, nothing in life is free? What, precisely is the cost to us all of "free" IE, in its various guises? Or do you disagree with that particular little chestnut? If so, perhaps you could take up the matter with Mr. Middleton. Cheers, Dan.

To: John Donahoe who wrote (16458)	1/20/1998 9:49:00 PM
From: Keith Hankin	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 24154

Gilette gives their razors away so you will buy their blades. Gilette is neither a monopoly nor is there barriers to competition in their market. The consent decree and the bundling issue only applies to separate products, not integrated functions. IE is an integrated function. So says MSFT. They also say that a ham sandwich can be included and it would not violate the consent decree. Your statement is merely spitting out the MSFT line rather than arguing the facts, which seem to trouble you so. The nature of capitalism is competition. As a result there will be winners and losers. Where is there real competition to MSFT? Where is the Pepsi to MSFT's Coke? Because of MSFT's leveraging their monopoly, it is nearly impossible for anyone to enter into competition at the stage of the game that NSCP did and "win".

To: John Donahoe who wrote (16458)	1/20/1998 9:50:00 PM
From: Bill Ulrich	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 24154

This is the argument of a loser. No John, it is the argument of somebody who merely disagreed with your point, and explained why in a civil fashion without calling you names. The argument of a loser, is the response from one who cannot do the same. Gilette gives their razors away so you will buy their blades. Nope. I just got back from the store, and the razors all had price tags. There were a few freebies on the sides of Barbasol cans, but even these have a cost which somebody is paying for somewhere down the line, not to mention the fact that they are special item promos. IE is an integrated function. Nope. Somebody in court is trying to argue that, and the judge still isn't convinced. BTW, you completely side-stepped Compaq. Compaq can put any browser they want on their 'puters. Agree or not? It's either A or B, there is no C. The nature of capitalism is competition. As a result there will be winners and losers. Yes, you got one right. It does not, however, address what I said. Now, you probably thought I said the DOJ has a responsibility to keep Netscape in business. That's wrong. What I said is that Netscape has a right to competitively co-exist in the marketplace. If they screw-up on their own through overbudget hiring binges, or just plain management ineptitude, then&#151fine&#151let them go under and less power to them. Your comment does not at all consider that Microsoft is not acting competitively. They are not beating up on Netscape with a slightly better browser at a slightly better price. No way. They are giving away something to all the sheep and lemming consumers who will take it which is not decisively superior. It's, at best, about the same, and even causing technical problems for a lot of them. Going out on a limb, I wonder if you can debate this gracefully, or just sling mud. -MrB&#153