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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Raymond James Norris who wrote (18269)	6/25/1998 12:56:00 AM
From: Emile Vidrine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

" But when we get to it, I'd be more than pleased to spell out the proof. The empirical proof." You have no empirical proof except the false words of Mohammad in the Koran. Mohammad states this falsehood in the Koran and that is the only proof that you have. Your opinions and the wild opinions of other Moslems or not acceptable. I repeat, the Crucifixion of Jesus is an historical fact established both by the eyewitness accounts in the Gospels as well as secualr writtings of Pontius Pilate, Josephus, Philo, Tacitus, the Palestinian Talmud, the Babylonian Talmud etc. This is only the tip of the iceberg. The historical accuracy of the Old Testament has been established by numerous archeological digs.

To: Raymond James Norris who wrote (18269)	6/25/1998 11:23:00 AM
From: IN_GOD_I_TRUST	Respond to of 39621

Raymond, I am reposting this because I did not get a response. You were concerned I would stop our dialogue but I told you I would not. So maybe you missed this one, so I'll repost it..... --------------------------------------------------------------------- You impress me with your knowledge, and are bombarding me with information. Unfortunately, I don't see where you are going other than proving who Muhammad might be. I disagree with you on who he his and how he fits into the scripture you are supplying. I also don't see why you need to involve transcribing errors and inconsistencies in different verses of the bible in our conversation. I did not ask for that. But just so you know, it's all explainable! Let's get to the heart of the matter. Let's talk about fundamentals first, namely God and his plan. That's what I asked you in my last reply. I don't think you answered the questions I asked. What is your belief? How do we reconcile ourselves with God because of sin? What does God want us to know and do? I'll ask these questions below again. Please do not be insulted but you are throwing a lot of information around that I am not looking for. I could address it all, and show you where you and I disagree, but it will take many days, maybe months or years. Please just answer these questions about the fundamentals of your religion: 1. Who is Jesus Christ? 2. The whole bible is a complete work that describes the Messiah cover to cover. Complete and without error. There are literally hundreds of versus in the Old Testament that speak of Messiah, as well as atonement for sin, which is the heart of the matter. The OT speaks of sin separating us from God and we need atonement. It speaks consistently of how that atonement is achieved through blood sacrifice. We need atonement for our sin! How do we get it? I studied Muhammad and the Qur'an briefly. I am not bringing up what I have learned purposefully. I could start telling you about what the Qur'an and Muhammad inconsistencies are, but I won't. I'm not conversing to do that. I want to know your fundamental beliefs. What do you believe in and why? I told you what I believe. Tell me what you do. Please answer these two questions above. Then once we know where each other is coming from we could involve other issues. It's important to understand one's belief structure in order to understand the person. Thank you and have patience with me. Let's just start at the basics. Then we can graduate into the specifics, as you have been trying to do ... Steve

To: Raymond James Norris who wrote (18269)	6/25/1998 1:43:00 PM
From: Chris land	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

Raymond, Is it true that before Islam came into existence the Sabeans in Arabia worshipped the moon god, who in turn married the sun goddess, who gave birth to three goddesses? Is it true that these three were called Al-lat, Al-uzza and Manat and were worshipped as the "Daughters of Allah?" Is it true then that Allah was the moon god? Is it true that the cresent moon is everywhere in Islam? Is it true that even Ramadan begins and ends with the cresent moon? Is it true that Muhammad declared himself to be Allah's prophet? Christ is the only true way of salvation. Chris

To: Raymond James Norris who wrote (18269)	6/25/1998 2:36:00 PM
From: Chris land	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 39621

Raymond, Is it true that Muhammad was involved in raiding caravans for his own personal gain? Is it true that Muhammad said, "Allah had no son"? (doesn't mention no daughters) Is it true that Muhammad didn't believe Jesus died on the cross? Is it true that Muslims face towards Mecca when they pray believing that it's a holy thing to do? Is it true that Muslims are led to believe that Muhammad was even greater than Jesus? Is it true that if a Muslim dies while fighting his enemies for the cause of Allah that he will go to a paradise where babes will be dropping grapes in his mouth? Chris