Some of president's
sworn statements are
ambiguous
By Michael Tackett
Washington Bureau
July 30, 1998
WASHINGTON -- On the cold morning
of Jan. 17, precisely at 10:30 a.m.,
President Clinton sat as a defendant in his
lawyer's conference room a block from the
White House and began answering
questions under oath for five hours in the
Paula Jones lawsuit.
The questions, stunning in their specificity
and sexually graphic detail, caught the
president off guard, especially the ones
about former White House intern Monica
Lewinsky. The answers he gave could help
build the foundation for possible perjury or
obstruction of justice charges by
Independent Counsel Kenneth Starr.
On several key points, the president's
answers clearly contradict the versions of
the truth reportedly offered by Lewinsky
and others. But on other points that are
often portrayed as contradictions, the
president's answers are ambiguous and
possibly less damaging.
A review of a substantial portion of the
215-page deposition suggests that while
Clinton unequivocally denied any sexual
relations--which for purposes of the
deposition included a broad range of
intimate contact--he was more ambiguous
on other details. Eighty-eight pages of the
deposition remain under seal.
The night before Clinton gave the
deposition, Jones' lawyers had been briefed
by Linda Tripp, who had taped some 20
hours of conversations with her former
colleague Lewinsky. Armed with that
information they were able to surprise the
president with a number of questions,
though Clinton knew that Lewinsky had
been subpoenaed to testify as a witness in
the Jones case.
''Did you have an extramarital sexual affair
with Monica Lewinsky?'' asked James
Fisher, one of Jones' lawyers.
''No,'' the president replied.
''If she told someone that she had a sexual
affair with you beginning in November of
1995 would that be a lie,'' Fisher pressed.
''It certainly would not be the truth,''
Clinton said.
At that point, Lewinsky had filed an affidavit
in which she too had denied having sexual
relations with the president, an account
Clinton called ''absolutely true.''
But Starr's investigation is focusing on much
more than merely whether the president lied
about sex and is instead focusing on issues
of whether there was obstruction of justice
or of enlisting a witness to lie under oath,
known as subornation of perjury.
On those issues, Clinton's answers were
more equivocal and may place a higher
burden on Starr to prove deceit.
For instance, Clinton acknowledged that he
had met with Lewinsky several times, but he
couldn't recall any precise number. He also
conceded that it was possible that he had
been alone with her in the Oval Office.
''I don't recall, but as I said, she worked at
the legislative affairs office, they always had
somebody there on the weekends,'' Clinton
said. ''I typically worked some weekends.
Sometimes they'd bring me things on the
weekends. She--it seems to me she brought
things to me once or twice on the
weekends.''
He also conceded that he might have been
alone with Lewinsky in his private kitchen
located just off the Oval Office, but he
noted that two naval aides had ''total,
unrestricted access'' to that area and that
others could freely walk in there.
Clinton said he could recall Lewinsky's
being in the pantry area when she had
dropped off a pizza during a government
shutdown. ''I do not believe that she was
there alone, however,'' the president said.
He also allowed that Lewinsky might have
been in the White House between the hours
of midnight and 6 a.m. when he too was
working late. ''There may have been a time
when we all were up working late. . . . I just
can't say that there could have been a time
when that occurred, I just--but don't
remember it.''
On two other key issues-- whether the
president or any of his top aides with his
knowledge had encouraged Lewinsky to lie
under oath and whether she was given
assistance in securing a job in exchange for
that testimony--the president was again
inconclusive and, at times, long-winded.
He said he didn't think that any of his
lawyers had told him that Lewinsky had
received a subpoena in the Jones case,
though he allowed that aide Bruce Lindsey
might have known. ''I don't have a specific
memory,'' he said.
Asked whether he had ever talked to
Lewinsky about the possibility that she
might be asked to testify in the Jones case,
the president said:
''I'm not sure, and let me tell you why I'm
not sure. It seems to me the, the, the--I
want to be as accurate as I can here. Seems
to me the last time she was there to see (his
secretary) Betty (Currie) before Christmas
we were joking about how you all . . . were
going to call every woman I'd ever talked to
. . .
''And I said that you-all might call every
woman I ever talked to and ask them that,
and so I said you would qualify, or
something like that. I don't, I don't think we
ever had more of a conversation than that
about it, but I might have mentioned
something to her about it, because when I
saw how long the witness list was, or I
heard about it, before I saw, but actually by
the time I saw it her name was in it, but I
think that was after all this had happened. I
might have said something like that, so I
don't want to say for sure I didn't, because I
might have said something like that.''
On the issue of helping Lewinsky find a job,
Clinton conceded that his confidant, Vernon
Jordan, had helped but that he did not
direct Jordan to do so.
He also acknowledged that he might have
given her gifts. ''I give a lot of people gifts .
. . so I could have given her a gift, but I
don't remember a specific gift,'' he said.
Some legal analysts believe that while the
Jones deposition might have set the case in
motion, the testimony for the grand jury and
how it is also judged by the public and
Congress will determine his fate.
''The problem is the president appears to
be unwilling to admit that he had a sexual
relationship with Lewinsky,'' said Jonathan
Turley, a law professor at George
Washington University. ''The president is
counting on his popularity to defeat any
charges against him. He can't take any
action in his (testimony to Starr) that will
diminish his popularity.''
If it were later proven that the president did
have a sexual relationship with Lewinsky,
Turley said, he ''likely would face
impeachment and his popularity would
plummet.''
''The president's considerable skills and
ability are going to be of little use in this
deposition. He will be given no opportunity
to equivocate. And it will be extremely blunt
and graphic.'' |
