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Pastimes : SI Grammar and Spelling Lab -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Dayuhan who wrote (1456)	8/27/1998 2:52:00 AM
From: Yamakita	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 4711

Not sure I understand the question. What is it about the phrase you don't like? It does seem to have gained currency though. I'm pretty sure it started with the gay rights movement in the 70s, when plenty of gays came out of the closet / out of denial. Usage became increasingly common; today people seem to use it toward anyone with whom they disagree! Yamakita, grammar czar not phrase origin czar

To: Dayuhan who wrote (1456)	8/27/1998 8:00:00 AM
From: Dwight Taylor	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 4711

"to be in denial" That's easy. It is an ebonic phrase to describe where Egyptians like to swim when it is hot...

To: Dayuhan who wrote (1456)	8/27/1998 11:27:00 AM
From: E	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 4711

What is the status of the recently common verb "to be in denial"? To me it's the semantic equivalent of fingernails dragging across a blackboard, My two cents, Steve: I find it an offensive formulation, too, and I think I know why, and it has nothing to do with grammar. It seems to change the subject from the issue on which there is a disagreement to the psychological state of the one disagreed with. If I say to you, "You deny that man is descended from apes," it is a simple statement of fact on which both parties to the argument may agree, and on its face doesn't portray you as deluded. If I say to you, "You are in denial about the descent of man from apes," my statement contains the editorial implication that you are psychologically incapable of facing reality. "You deny" isn't patronizing and "You are in denial" is. Also: If you begin a communication with "You deny," you are obliged then to state with some precision what your own assertion, the one your adversary denies, is. But if you begin a communication with "You are in denial," that's all you are obliged to say: the convenient change of subject to your adversary's opacity obviates the necessity for you to formulate your own position precisely and succinctly, possibly subjecting it to further scrutiny. I agree, Steven-- it strikes me as psychobabble and so annoying and I would never say it except satirically. Elsa