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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jamey who wrote (20521)	9/2/1998 9:49:00 AM
From: Sam Ferguson	Read Replies (5) \| Respond to of 39621

Let me read you a little prayer based upon this idea of right. I heard it offered as a thanksgiving tribute. "Oh, God, we do thank thee that thou didst give thy only son to die for us! We thank thee that the innocent has suffered for the guilty, and that through the suffering and death of thy most holy son our sins are blotted out!" Monstrous! How would that work in a court of justice? What would you think of a person who coolly thanked a judge who had knowingly allowed the wrong man to be hung? What do you think of a code of morals that offers as one of its beautiful provisions the murder of the innocent instead of the punishment of the guilty? People ask what good I expect to come of an attack on Christianity. They ask me if I think Christianity does any direct harm. Yes! It makes a man unjust to believe in unjust doctrines. Any man who honestly believes in the righteousness of a system of vicarious rewards and punishments is ripe for any form of tyranny. And the more honestly he believes in it the less will he be a good man from principle. I want men and women to be good and true because it is right towards each other, and not because they are afraid of Hell. Honor towards people in this world, not fear of a fiend in the next -- that is my doctrine. That is the way to make men and women strong and brave and noble. Stop telling them they can't be good themselves; teach them that they must do right themselves. Make them self-dependent. Teach them to stand alone. Honor towards others, kindness, and love -- these are what make a man a good husband, a noble father -- king in his household. Fear never made any man a gentleman. Fear never made any woman a true wife or a good mother. Fear never covered the pitfalls of vice with anything stronger than the gloss of hypocrisy. When Reason's torch burned low, Faith led her victims by chains of ignorance into the land of hopeless superstition, and built her temple there. Quote from Helen Gardner's book, "Men, Women, and God." Thought you could answer this.

To: Jamey who wrote (20521)	9/2/1998 11:43:00 AM
From: PROLIFE	Respond to of 39621

Santiago, I doubt very seriously you can find many folks in this world who do not have traditions. There are many traditions even in the worship of God that do not IMO take away from the "Gospel" "Good News" . But coming from the background I came from I understand perfectly what traditions can become. They get to a point that they are law don't they? That is when we get in trouble. If I bind my "tradition" on you, then I am guilty. There are also many things that were done by the apostles, and the churches as we have recorded in the Bible. Do you think they are all traditions or do you think they should be taken seriously?? I could name more than a few of them. The Gospel has not changed. The Good News is that a perfect Sacrifice was provided for me, cause I could not provide it myself, and now that perfect Sacrifice "sat down" at the right hand of the Father, and is pleading for me, with His blood. I did not deserve it, I cannot earn it, all I can do is accept in in faith and """"TAKE UP MY CROSS AND FOLLOW HIM"""" hmmmmmm very interesting........... So I am sure you can come up with a big list of what you consider "traditions" but I would be careful, because the above says that there is something I can do to please my Father........hmmmmm. God Bless. ps. The only "Our God is an awesome God" I know is Rich Mullins version so if you remember the Jewish version, please post it. BTW Rich Mullins was killed a year or two ago, and they have recently released a collection of his music, that I hear is very very good, I don't have a copy yet. dan