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Non-Tech : Fight The Power! -Your Broker Just Screwed U - Now What? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: CanynGirl who wrote (67)	12/6/1998 12:17:00 PM
From: CanynGirl	Respond to of 323

This will help executions with online brokers. I can't wait to short NITE's stock <VBG> SEC OKs Net-Based Stock Markets by R. Scott Raynovich 12:30 p.m. 2.Dec.98.PST WASHINGTON -- The US Securities and Exchange Commission on Wednesday approved plans that would spur the development of online stock markets that could offer small investors better access to stock quotes. The new rules, which will become effective in about three months, will give so-called Alternative Trading Systems the right to register as either broker-dealers or as independent stock exchanges. ATS use sophisticated computer networks to bring together buyers and sellers of stock. They compete with stock markets like the New York Stock Exchange and the Nasdaq. The new rules would compel the ATS to reveal their stock quotes to the public, encouraging competition among the trading systems and decreasing the cut -- known as the spread -- taken by middlemen. What's more, big institutional investors would lose their edge over moms and pops trading through a PC. "This is a sea change," said Frederic W. Rittereiser, president and CEO of the Ashton Technology Group, a company that is setting up its own Alternative Trading System. "The rules have opened up the market. You'll see online brokerages setting up their own" ATS to bypass stock markets. At a meeting at SEC's headquarters in Washington SEC commissioners lauded the role of technology in streamlining stock trading and leveling the playing field for small investors. "Technology is fundamentally changing our marketplace," said SEC chairman Arthur Levitt. "Advancing technologies have altered and improved every facet of our markets." ATS connect buyers and sellers of stocks anonymously to each other through sophisticated computer networks. The biggest include Reuters Group's Instinet and Datek Online Holding's Island system. Currently, ATSes aren't required to make their prices available to the public. Big investors like mutual funds often can get better stock price on ATS than the general public can on the traditional exchanges. The new ATS rules were labeled as "deregulatory" by the SEC director of market regulation, Richard Lindsey, who voiced his hopes that they will encourage innovation and speedy development of online stock markets. "Retail investors will benefit from this," Lindsey said. "By encouraging innovation it's hopeful that our markets can take a step forward and provide more information to the public." In addition, the SEC loosened regulations on existing exchanges that would let them compete with the newer systems. Existing exchanges will be able to develop pilot trading systems for as long as two years without approval from the SEC. And exisiting exchanges can market new derivative products -— such as securities tied to stock-market indexes -— without prior SEC approval. Not everybody will be happy with the SEC's moves. Financial institutions are already grumbling about provisions designed to level the playing field by requiring even-handed display of price quotes in ATS markets. Some institutions openly protested "transparent pricing" in written comments. "Adoption of mandatory display rule of electronic markets would significantly impede our ability -— and the ability of most larger institutions -— to obtain the best executions for our clients," wrote William Haggerty of Bowman Capital Management, in a letter submitted to the SEC. While larger institutions may feel threatened by such changes, the SEC seems to be welcoming them as a way of democratizing trading for individual investors, who are heading increasingly to online brokerages. Automated markets that publish stock prices across computer networks will be more efficient at matching buyers with sellers, and are widely believed to be lowering the "spread" -- the difference between the ask and bid prices of a stock. Fans of online stock trading say the American public needs a more open market, not a closed one. Ashton's Rittereiser says that the new rules will spur online brokerages such as ETrade (EGRP), Datek, and Ameritrade (AMTD) to develop their own ATS market. "We will definitely register as exchange," said Matthew Andresen, president of Island ESN. "This opens up the arena to increased competition, and anytime you have competition, the end benefit is for the consumer." ATS have grown dramatically in the past few years. For example, Chairman Levitt said that ATS volume now accounted for 20 percent of the trades on Nasdaq, and he expects that to increase.

To: CanynGirl who wrote (67)	12/6/1998 12:19:00 PM
From: agent99	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 323

Just something else to watch out for with online brokers who route the orders. And something else to beware of, along the same lines. Some of my orders go through Discover, which routes orders to NITE, MASH, BRUT among others. I have placed orders to sell, for example, at a price, say 20 1/2, which is the bid. A minute after I place the order with Discover, the order shows up on Level 2 with NITE who bids 20 1/2 on my behalf. The stock trades at 20 1/2 and I'm not executed and NITE is still sitting there. Then a torrent orders are filled at 20 1/2 and suddenly NITE is bidding 20 5/8 along with others. Aha! I say...i must be filled. Then suddenly the price starts to drop. And is 20 1/4 . 3/8. I say PHEW! I'm glad I must have sold. But, after calling Discover, they say 'no fill'. After producing 'Time and Sales' and telling them that the order MUST be executed, because NITE was biddding 5/8 after all of the 20 1/2 sales went through (incidentally, they are usually dumbfounded that I know that it's NITE, because the Discover brokers don't have Level 2), they do some checking. "You're right, you were filled" has always been the case. EVERY TIME. I had caught NITE red-handed. I only use NITE as one example. It has also happened with the others they route to. The moral: You have to watch these guys like a hawk, because they steal your orders all the time. If I hadn't had Level 2, I would never have known that NITE had upped their bid through my price. Unfortunately, most public traders don't have Level 2 and don't even know they are being taken to the cleaners.

To: CanynGirl who wrote (67)	12/6/1998 5:34:00 PM
From: Scott	Respond to of 323

See my posting #1200 in the "Etrade Sucks" forum: I placed a sell order today, and it didn't get represented for several minutes. Meanwhile, the price traded through my price, and then dropped back down. Power Etrade Support's response was that the customer agreement allows them to arbitrarily review orders and hold them up for 3 minutes. As it says in the customer agreement: Though orders are usually routed to the marketplace within seconds, certain orders, at E*TRADE's sole discretion, may be subject to manual review and entry, which may cause delays in the processing of your orders. You also understand that you will receive the price at which your order executes in the marketplace, which may be different from the price at which the security or option is trading when your order is entered into our system. This means that although they are providing Level II, and RT quotes, if you see a bid or offer that you want to hit, then forget about any guarantee of a timely execution. This was not some wildly trading Internet stock. It cost me 1/8 on 1000 shares. They usually provide good representation and good fills, and their Stop Loss orders saved me a bundle yesterday, but if they are providing Level 2 and a special trading screen, they also should provide the execution speed that is necessary in that environment. Keep this in mind if you are considering Etrade for rapid trading.

To: CanynGirl who wrote (67)	12/7/1998 5:51:00 PM
From: WhipsawMcGraw	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 323

Oh no, that is horrible. What did you have: 50, 100 shares. Don't complain if you do not put in market orders. Think Canyon Lady, they do not get paid if the order does not get executed. I am so sick of you people complaining about not getting orders executed. The Broker Dealers do not make one cent if the orders are not executed. Do you think they want to fail, go out of business to screw you?