SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Father Terrence who wrote (29470)1/30/1999 9:45:00 PM
From: Graystone  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 108807
 
You mean the business owners in Sarajevo right ?
or
I suppose ducking was smarter than hawking ?

What we teach our young ones has to be correct. It is a fine line.

Savings vs Survival
Business vs Bullets

In addition to that we must impress upon them the fact that the world is full of human beings who are very dangerous. Bad things will happen.



To: Father Terrence who wrote (29470)1/30/1999 9:49:00 PM
From: Ilaine  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 108807
 
Well, maybe we should determine whether we mean the same thing by "rational."

Is a person who is in the process of taking LSD, or another strong hallucinogen "rational"? I would say not.

Is a person who is in the process of being transported by strong visions of say, God and Heaven, "rational"? Again, I would say not.

Is a person who is in the process of being transported by strong visions of say, music, poetry or art "rational"? Again, I would say not.

Is a person who is engaged in sexual congress with someone whom he/she desires deeply, and enjoys utterly, at that moment "rational"? Again, I would say not.

"Rational" is a type of thought based on reason, but reason is not the only way of thinking. Whirling dervishes are transported to a non-rational mindset, but they are not evil. Buddhist monks achieving satori are not rational, and are not evil. Viking warriors who are berserker-gang are not rational, and are not necessarily evil, although I think that if they initiated the fray, they are acting evilly.



To: Father Terrence who wrote (29470)1/30/1999 10:10:00 PM
From: E  Read Replies (3) | Respond to of 108807
 
<<The norm is to be rational, but most, when children, are
programmed to become irrational. I am not talking about
imagination or dreams, but irrational thought that
persistently ignores reality in favor of fantasy or wishful
thinking.>>

I like to believe that, and if I confused what I wished with what was the case, as is so commonly done, I would. But when I read your words I think of how differently other cultures -- everyone in them -- interpret the word 'rational,' and define the word 'fantasy.'

I had two secretaries once who fought over whether one had cast a spell over the other. The evidence was a container of milk someone had left on the 'victim's' desk. It wasn't poisoned or anything. It was just there. They had always been friends. No one in the office except the Americans (this was in Africa) thought this was irrational. Later, a clerk in this same office was instructed by me to make a series of telephone calls. She didn't do it, and a couple of hours later, when her negligence had created problems, simply declared to me that I had not told her to make any calls. The list was still on her desk. There was no higher authority that she could have been attempting to convince. I was her boss. It was clear to me that she was behaving irrationally. It was clear to her that she was behaving rationally. I still don't understand these things. Another employee, a key person without whom the office couldn't function unless we arranged in advance for a substitute to carry out her duties, decided not to return to work for several days after a holiday, and chose not to inform the office. This was not the first time this sort of thing had happened. She had been warned repeatedly. So I fired her, as I had told her I would do the next time she did this.

I can tell you she was genuinely indignant. Furious. Using personal contacts in high places, she went to a government official and complained. To my amazement, the only reason I won the argument was that she hadn't asked her husband's advice about whether she should come in to work or not. She was behaving irrationally to me; but not to most who knew of the situation.

Any time members of one culture find themselves submerged in another, they lose their firm grip on the concept, "fantasy vs reality."

Closer to home, speaking of fantasy vs reality: There was a time when I was supporting our family alone while my husband worked on a particular project. This was a period of several years. During that time, I applied for a credit card. It was necessary for me to get my unemployed, dependent husband's signed permission to get this card. This was in the United States, and not so very long ago, either.



To: Father Terrence who wrote (29470)1/31/1999 9:25:00 AM
From: epicure  Respond to of 108807
 
>The norm is to be rational, but most, when children, are programmed to become
irrational. I am not talking about imagination or dreams, but irrational thought that
persistently ignores reality in favor of fantasy or wishful thinking.<

Children are not normally rational Terrence. Any good book on child development well explain that children up until about 6 have magical thinking- they cannot perform concrete operations. Along with this they constantly engage in magical thinking- it is not programmed by adults- it is already in there- and is probably a coping mechanism.

What is more it takes enormous effort not to engage in magical thinking as an adult. It should be clear to you that the default system in humans is to engage in magical belief systems- if this were not true than the vast majority of humans on this planet would not belong to a religion. Rationality, or trying to be rational, is the exception, and one can see it has always been the exception- one need only look at the long history of heretics- they are usually men of reason. Why are they men of reason? Because it is always easier to go after the minority. So when the neo- nazis REALLY come they will be coming for people like me, and my guess is Bob won't hide me- So I'll be going to Steve's house.