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Gold/Mining/Energy : Gold Price Monitor -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (27705)	2/4/1999 12:59:00 AM
From: Gord Bolton	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116795

<<I don't why can't think this out and at least recognize that gold is no guarantee of anything. It can be confiscated, or the banks can manipulate it up and down.>> Two guarantees, death and taxes. Short of theft, work must be done to obtain gold. Printing paper is very cheap and can be used as taxation. Inflation is taxation without authorization (representation). If gold goes up in price relative to other commodities ol49er and company will buy two pans and head upstream.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (27705)	2/4/1999 7:31:00 AM
From: long-gone	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116795

Ron, Over the next few days (and moreover months and years) you will need to formulate some answers, if not for us, for yourself. You need to come to terms with this most baser of malice you hold for the precious metals, their production, their position as a store of value, (and maybe) the position of all commodities in the economic brave new world. You will also need to come to grips with what you do or do not consider manipulation. It is rumored (from prior well tested) sources Buffet has again been in the silver market and has begun to invest deeply in the production. He has taken a rather extensive position - with-out use of margin - we are left to understand. There will again soon be a(some-what) Hunt-like shortage in silver against a base of new demands. Will his inventory positions be manipulative? Will mine(though far-far smaller than his)? It is(was) only a matter of time before the supply / demand equation fell into a deficit. A double digit price is forecast by all but the most conservative(bull market biased) estimates. Silver mining will again become profitable in these United States - perhaps for the rest man's time on earth. Humans will again be able to make a living by putting their hands in the earth. Now, the questions: will this move be "manipulative" as the inventory will not be gone? When some large brokerage houses or banks are caught short will you then speak of systemic risk? Will you, again, deny the justly earned profits of miners, and investors to give them to speculators, bankers and brokers? Will there then be inflation when silver has more than tripled? Are you short the metal (gold), short the miners - some of whom will again show a nice profit, against the idea of a metal as money(or being worth money), or against the miners from an ethical or ecological position? This is the question.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (27705)	2/4/1999 7:31:00 AM
From: Mark Bartlett	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 116795

Ron, <<Ask yourself this question: If the CBs are able to manipulate the price of gold in either direction, then which monetary system is really stronger?? The price of gold is a constant ... it is currency(s) that moves up a down, relative to gold. <<If gold were so powerful, you wouldn't be complaining so much about its depressed price.>> My complaint has more to do with the fact the world economies are generally in very bad shape and gold has historically been the lifeline for these times. By not having this lifeline .... what happens? The US/IMF (mostly) control the destiny of these countries. Seems to me the game that is being played out right now by the US (and a few others) is, how much control of the world can we get. Some of the countries which are in trouble, could have used gold to assist them in getting out of their difficulties (in fact some did, despite the lousy price), but as it is, they have to rely mostly on the US/IMF for their loans, that sooner or later go bad ... then the currency manipulations that unfold. Then the loans have to be paid back in US dollars, when the currency is weak. Then these countries have to up their interest rates .... quite a vicious cycle. The whole charade is a mess .. and IMO the discipline of gold could have rectified part of this mess. You claim that those of us that want gold to rise are irresponsible and are just looking out for our self interests .... I submit that it is you that is irrespon sible because you are oppose a system that instills some semblance of discipline ... and helps to prevent messes like this in the first place. And before you say it, we can all go back in history and find examples when even under the gold standard things got skewed ... but other than a few manias, nothing like the present mess. MB

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (27705)	2/4/1999 9:35:00 PM
From: Mark Bartlett	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 116795

Ron, <<Of course, this is probably one of reasons they emphasized gold when the constitution was penned. They weren't disciplined enough to prevent unbridled printing of currency by any bank that wanted to. >> Nor are they now. <<I don't why can't think this out and at least recognize that gold is no guarantee of anything. It can be confiscated, or the banks can manipulate it up and down.>> There is no better way IMO to undermine fiat then to "confiscate" and "undermine" gold. In both cases it is just one more admission the system is in trouble. Taking away the barometer does now make the air pressure go away. <<I still wonder what will happen when people start selling their hoarded gold, either to raise to buy goods with in a Y2K disruption, or as a result of few severe disruptions from it (let us pray).>> Have you ever thought what may happen if all of the electronic trades that we all take for granted now, were suddenly thrown into chaos.... who own what and how much .... and what if you could not sort out the mess? Electrons are hard to count ... gold is relatively simple in comparison. <<You think gold's price is depressed now, you had better pray that Y2K is somewhat serious enough to give gold a raison d'etre.. >> The greed, stupidity and avarice of man ... as durable a quality as gold itself, gives me all the reason I need to hold a little gold. MB