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To: smith who wrote (11435)	3/30/1999 5:57:00 PM
From: Esteban	Respond to of 16892

What's 'outside' mean? lower than ask or higher than bid if you want to buy? Generally, inside means between the spread. However reading between the lines, I think inside is what Vet meant in the post you refer to. The terminology confused me too. Once my order has been displayed to the world on Island those "outside" MMs no longer have a chance to play with it. They still may trade around you, but at leastthen you can see it happening. How you can see it? Using some software or telling by its pattern? You "see it" by watching the bid/ask quotes and trades. If the spread narrowed just after you placed your order to your price and size, you usually assume that the shares shown are yours. Or you can check the Island book. When you see trades executed at the price you are representing and you haven't filled, you know the MMs are trading around you.

To: smith who wrote (11435)	4/1/1999 3:21:00 PM
From: The Vet	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 16892

>>What I most often do is place a limit order which is just 1/32 or 1/16 outside the marketable price and therefore I get it on to Island immediately. What's 'outside' mean? lower than ask or higher than bid if you want to buy?>> Sorry I was not clear on this. I mean just lower than the bid on a buy and just higher than the ask on a sell. You may have to cancel and place another order if the market moves away but at least you can do than immediately if it is on Island. On your other question just watch either streaming quotes or preferably level II. You will see your bid or ask on Island and other MM's accepting the same price but ignoring yours. Unfortuanately it happens all the time with soem stocks...