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Pastimes : Kosovo -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/5/1999 10:22:00 PM
From: George Papadopoulos  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 17770
 
Most shameful act in 20th century
April 30, 1999

Most shameful act in 20th century - intellectuals and artists of the entire world
condemns aggression on Yugoslavia and send message: "God will punish America"

"I can not watch with approval how the most powerful world force carries out air
strikes against a small country in Middle Europe. I am not able to understand why
innocent people are killed from the sky", says the most famous modern writer
Djerdj Konrad, former president of the International PEN club in front of his
students in Freiburg, Germany.

If NATO does not like the government " why has he to shell bombs over Serbian
people? What justice is it, where is the moral base there?" - asks the prominent
writer.

"Who gave them right to this? How is it possible that NATO, opposite to all
international norms, attacks the country that has not threatened to any country
member of NATO Alliance? Has inhabitants of NATYO countries authorized their
officers to kill several hundreds, or possibly thousands, civilians in Yugoslavia
without any court judgement? How could they help Albanians Kosmet by destroying
bridges in Novi Sad? - continued Konrad with his questions. He clearly stated that
answers to these questions are well known to all good-will people, but majority of
them must not tell them publicly.

"NATO says that it must not lose the war. It can not humiliate itself. But what
kind of victory would it be? Who would be happy for it? If bombarding should have
been continued only because we had told to do it, then the Western Military
Alliance came to the track of lies where vengeance prevail over reasoning and
humanism. That one who permanently threatens becomes captive of his own words",
added the writer.

Famous Spanish writer Camilo Jose Sela winner of the Nobel Prize for literature
has today severely condemned the criminal NATO aggression on Yugoslavia, reports
Itar Tass.

"It is the most shameful act in 20th century", said Sela in the interview to the
Spanish daily "Diario 16", adding that this what is going on creates him "the
unbearable pain".

Jose Sela thinks that bombarding of Yugoslavia is an "absolute nonsense" and that
it is unacceptable to solve problems by means of force and weapons at the
threshold of the third millenium.

Russian poet Jevgenij Jevtusenko said that history goes back to the stage of crime
writes the British daily "Guardian". "It came back in the end of 20th century in
the Balkans where the First World War started as well", writes Jevtusenko in his
article "Nightmare of reason" and warns: "Do not demonize any people, since
somebody could start demonizing you yourself."

"That is the war of cowards and poltroons, this is the war against Serbian people
who like hero King Leonide in Thermopile Gorge defends his freedom and at the same
time the freedom of the entire Europe. France has been a symbol of freedom and
human rights already from the Revolution in 1789, but on March 24, 1999 France
sold its heart and lost its generosity", said Patrique Bario, French writer
yesterday in the Serbian Association of Writers.

Famous Russian writer Viktor Astafjev has said today that "God will punish America
because it tortures Yugoslavia and destroy its cultural and historical
inheritance".

"As a former soldier I am against war in general, particularly wars in which
innocent civilians are targets", said Astafjev and emphasized: " Those who bomb
Yugoslavia should understand that they mutilate not only that state and its long
tradition, but themselves as well."




To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/5/1999 10:25:00 PM
From: George Papadopoulos  Respond to of 17770
 
Family history spurs on Nato general
=============================

FROM BEN MACINTYRE IN WASHINGTON
May 4, 1999
The Times
the-times.co.uk

WESLEY CLARK'S determination to fight "ethnic cleansing" in Kosovo is
partly a personal crusade underpinned by the discovery that his
grandfather was a Russian Jew who fled the pogroms in the 1890s.
General Clark, Nato's Supreme Allied Commander in Europe, was brought
up a Protestant in Arkansas. It was not until his twenties that he
learnt about his grandfather, a formative experience for a man whose
hatred of Serb ethnic cleansing reflects the importance he attaches to
his history, said friends and family interviewed by The New York
Times. His Jewish roots provide a bond with Madeleine Albright, the US
Secretary of State, who did not learn about the deaths of her
grandparents in Nazi concentration camps, until after taking the job.




To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/5/1999 10:28:00 PM
From: George Papadopoulos  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 17770
 
Watch for yaacov to sneak in something about this<g>

Greek journalists rally against NATO bombs,freedom of the press

Athens, 04/05/1999 (ANA)

Hundreds of Greek journalists rallied in central Athens outside their
union's offices yesterday to mark International Press Freedom Day,
demanding an end to NATO bombings in Yugoslavia.

The demonstrators also demanded an end to what they termed the "murderous
attacks against journalists" and paid tribute to the victims from a recent
NATO missile attack against the Serbian state television building in
downtown Belgrade.

"This day is one of mourning and respect for the 500 journalists who died
in the 'reporting battle' between 1988-1998 and the 36 victims of the past
four months, of which 27 were in Yugoslavia," a statement read.

Journalists further demanded a return of Kosovar refugees to their homes
and an immediate commencement of dialogue for a political solution to the
Kosovo crisis.

Kaklamanis cites double standard between Kosovo, Cyprus :Parliament
President Apostolos Kaklamanis yesterday praised the Greek correspondents
who have covered "in the best possible way" the events in Yugoslavia.

Speaking to the media representatives, who presented him a resolution after
their rally, Mr. Kaklamanis said "... certainly, for each crime there are
causes and pretences. The behaviour of the Milosevic regime in Kosovo was a
problem...(but) an existing problem is not approached through bombardment,
through more violence...through actual or fictional NATO bombing mishaps".

He added that "for 25 years no action has been taken regarding the
continuing drama of 200,000 refugees caused by the Turkish 'Attila' in
Cyprus."




To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/5/1999 10:35:00 PM
From: George Papadopoulos  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 17770
 
How can you not feel outraged after reading about the effect of the humanitarian nato criminals!

Tuesday, May 4, 1999

DISPATCH FROM KOSOVO NATO Bombs Kill 17 More
Civilians Assault: Bus is second one hit in two days.

"Nada was among 43 civilians
who survived Monday's bombing. In the room of 10 women
and children where she lay in Pec's main hospital, one of
the wounded was a blond girl about 4 years old. The
wedding Nada and her mother had set out to plan must
have seemed so far away. A piece of shrapnel had
severed Nada's spine like a knife, and the director of Pec's
hospital, Dr. Miodrag Jasovic, judged the girl's chances of
walking again at zero."

By PAUL WATSON, Times Staff Writer

SAVINE VODE, Yugoslavia--The war must have seemed
so far away when Nada Matanovic boarded the bus
Monday that would bring her high into the mountains, and
beneath NATO's bombs. A girl of 15, Nada got on the
express bus in the western Kosovo city of Pec with her
mother so they could go to Montenegro, Serbia's sister
republic in Yugoslavia, to meet with the young man who
had asked for the teenager's hand in marriage. She
wanted her mother's approval so that she would not bring
shame on her family in the farming village of Babajloc.
Around 11:40 Monday morning, just as the highway coach
slowly rounded a hairpin turn and stopped at a police
checkpoint in the snowy peaks about 12 miles north of
Pec, NATO bombs fell, killing an estimated 17 civilians.
Jagged chunks of shrapnel were sprayed into a white
trailer that served as the police post, and at least four
police officers and two soldiers were among the dead.
Like most governments in wartime, Yugoslavia's does not
release the official death toll for soldiers, preferring to keep
NATO guessing about how much damage it is inflicting on
armed combatants. NATO officials said they had no
information on the airstrike. Two days earlier, a NATO
bomb killed 39 bus passengers as the vehicle crossed a
bridge about 1 p.m., heading south on the main road to
Pristina, the capital of Kosovo, a province of Serbia. NATO
said it was targeting a key military supply route, and that
the bus crossed the bridge after the weapon was dropped.
Even though Serbian forces, and in some cases the fear
of NATO bombs, have driven hundreds of thousands of
ethnic Albanians from their homes and into refugee
camps, Kosovo is not deserted yet. Hundreds of
thousands of civilians, many of them ethnic Albanians, still
live here. As NATO intensifies attacks on roads and
bridges, many are left to wonder whether Kosovo has
become a free-fire zone. Nada was among 43 civilians
who survived Monday's bombing. In the room of 10 women
and children where she lay in Pec's main hospital, one of
the wounded was a blond girl about 4 years old. The
wedding Nada and her mother had set out to plan must
have seemed so far away. A piece of shrapnel had
severed Nada's spine like a knife, and the director of Pec's
hospital, Dr. Miodrag Jasovic, judged the girl's chances of
walking again at zero. "We were stopped at the police
checkpoint, and suddenly, out of nowhere, they started
bombing us," Nada's mother, Julka, said at the hospital.
"The bus was crowded with people, and after the first
explosion, we all tried to hide on the floor. "Someone
started screaming: 'Get out! Get out of the bus! They're
passengers, police and soldiers. Then, witnesses said, a
NATO warplane dropped a cluster bomb. It released
dozens of bomblets that exploded into bits of shrapnel and
blew holes about the size of baseballs into the asphalt.
One of the yellow canisters failed to detonate. It sat,
threatening to go off, just a few feet from the corpse of a
police officer in blue camouflage who died flat on his back,
far behind the bus. A metal label riveted to a round piece of
the main cluster bomb landed in the middle of the road
and provided these details on the bomb's origins and type:
"Sensor proximity FZU 39/B," the metal plate said. The lot
number was MN89F005-010, and the part number was
77757-10. It was made in the U.S. and the manufacturer
was listed as Magnavox. Nada's mother was dragging the
girl into a forest nearby when the cluster bomblets
exploded along the road, forcing dazed survivors to flee
deeper into the trees, Matanovic and other witnesses said.
Police and soldiers later arrived to transport survivors to
the hospital. When a small group of journalists reached
the scene about 3:15 p.m., police were loading the last
corpses into a truck.

All of Paul Watson's dispatches from
Kosovo are available on The Times' Web site at
latimes.com.




To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/5/1999 10:36:00 PM
From: George Papadopoulos  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 17770
 
Some interesting quotes:

The Arsenals of Democracy:

The arsenals of democracy are deep. We are not anywhere near
running out. We can fight this for months and months, if not
years.

-- Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Harry Shelton

--------------------------------------------
Clinton the weather-historian:

Historically, the weather is better in May than in April,
better in June than in May, better in July than in June.

-- U.S. President Bill Clinton on last Thursday

------------------------------------------
A reason why geography should be re-introduced in the American public
school system:

NATO had destroyed the last remaining bridge over the Danube in
the city of Novi Sad: Kosovo is becoming even more isolated from
Serbia.

-- Jamie Shea, NATO spokesman

(Novi Sad is more than 300miles from Kosovo, and there is no bridge
over Danube necessary to reach Kosovo from Belgrade)
--------------------------------------------

The reverend Solana speaking:

Bombardment of Yugoslavia is an attempt to defend moral values
21st century Europe would cherish.

-- Xavier Solana
---------------------------------------------

...

We do know that we must do more to reach out to our children and
teach them to express their anger and to resolve their conflicts
with words, not weapons.

-- Bill CLinton (on Colorado high-school shootings...)

----------------------------------

This is old, but still funny:

He dropped his bomb in good faith, as you would expect of a trained
pilot from a democratic country.

-- NATO officials, explaining bombing of a refugee convoy.

------------------------------------
...

The train was on or near the bridge, but it was not the target!

-- NATO officials, explaining bombing of a passanger train.
--------------------------------------




To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/5/1999 10:52:00 PM
From: Broken_Clock  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 17770
 
brees,
Your post brings to mind some interesting thoughts(to which, if I am bold enough to discuss among my peers, I am shouted down -g-).

<As you know Muslims are allowed to have more than one wife.>

I do not find anywhere in the Bible where believers are commanded to have just one wife, contrary to popular church doctrine.

<Slavery was forbidden in Islam as commanded by God over 1400 yrs
ago.>

The Bible does not command that slavery be outlawed either.

The Bible(God) does command that husbands, wives, masters and servants treat each other with the best of both our love and God's love. I think you'll find that in any religion, the majority give lip service to tis core beliefs. Selfishness pretty much rules the world. Man loves to bend God's word to fit our own motives.



To: one_less who wrote (6933)5/6/1999 12:21:00 PM
From: Paul Merriwether  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 17770
 

<<
Wow. I have to say, I appreciate your prompt response and consideration. Two
over riding comments on my part. 1) You appear to have drawn a line in the sand
and will take a side against any issue presented on behalf of Muslims. 2) I have to
give you credit for having some consideration in principle for justice on behalf of
innocent people.
>>

Why thankyou! I have nothing against moslems in general. Afterall they constitute 20% of humanity. And why should it surprise you that I or others in the west care about "innocent civilians".

<<You insist that I have some affinity for Saddam because I am a Muslim.... I despise him. >>

OK. Wasn't clear from your original argument. It seemed like you were using your own version of moral relativism(he does it, because its crushing armed insurrection, and so does everyone else, therefore its OK etc. I am sorry that I misunderstood you).

<< You must read
those extreme anti-muslim web pages. Get some comic books if you like fiction.
>>

brees, I read this in a book, written by a practising "devout" Moslem, who happens to hate the house of Saud("House of Saud" by Said Aburish). There are many other documented facts that I suggest you peruse through.. I happen to have friends from all over the world(thanks to 6 years in grad school), and allow me to assure you that Saudi is not the benign place you want me to believe. Slavery has been an institution in Moslem society. Please correct me if I am wrong, but the Ottomans literally enslaved the Greeks, Serbs, Armenians throughout the middle ages. The central asians used to have an efficient "slave barter system". So it didnt die out 1400 years ago as you would lead me to believe.

<< I did not
witness anything akin to what you describe.
>>
therefore it must not exist!!!

<< We are seen as an unprincipled, egotistical
bully bent on having our piece of everyone elses pie.
>>
Mostly by fanatics hoping to charge up crowds, and dictators and demagogues using the imagery of "an evil empire" to cling to power.

Please understand I have nothing against Moslems. I have had detailed discussions about it with people(unlike your automatic assumption that I am "a broken record repeating CNNs lines"). The religion itself is interesting(more like Judaism than Christianity), but (most of) the people however are firmly and hopelessly stuck somewhere in the 8th century.