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Politics : The Left Wing Porch -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lane3 who wrote (3244)	1/18/2001 9:42:52 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 6089

Gosh- there is no moral highground. At the edges, and the extremes, it is all about hate. Steve Rogers said it best when he said it was a circle. I think liberals are more likely to get their hands dirty with the work of helping the oppressed- but of course that completely depends on what you mean by helping and oppressed. When you talk about moral high ground- what do you mean by moral highground? Pretending to feel compassion for a leader that was about everything you hated- or really feeling it? If Hitler got alzheimers would we be obliged to be sorry, in order to be on the moral high ground? I know people who worked in Latin America who think Reagan was like Hitler- I don't happen to agree with them, but if you DID feel the way they did, would it be moral to still be sorry for him?

To: Lane3 who wrote (3244)	1/18/2001 9:47:54 AM
From: Rarebird	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 6089

<I had thought the lefties laid claim to the high moral ground. I must have misunderstood.> Liberals are human beings too. That is to say, they have a Mind, which is the origin of all ideas, a Heart, which is the origin of all emotion, and a Will, which is the faculty of judgement. Do you realize how Reagan's policies squeezed the middle class in this country and created many more poor people? Or, would you like to educate me about your small "l" as in libertarian philosophy and how all this was just, fitting, appropriate and right?

To: Lane3 who wrote (3244)	1/18/2001 10:04:53 AM
From: Daniel Schuh	Respond to of 6089

I had thought the lefties laid claim to the high moral ground. I must have misunderstood. Er, most people lay claim to the high moral ground. I don't think the self-anointed Ashcroft and the people who support him would admit to yielding any of that territory to "lefties" of any flavor. Whatever his current and past mental state, Reagan still has an army of flacks and pundits at his service to say what a great guy he was and is. Most of the people who were out of favor in the Reagan era don't have that luxury It's unfortunate that Reagan's current health is bad, but many people share his fate. It is of some historical interest, though, to look back at when the symptoms started to appear. Politics in the modern era is a pretty harsh game, from everything I've seen. For all Clinton's failings, he at least passed Truman's test, he stood the heat pretty well. By comparison, Reagan got kid gloves treatment, I think maybe some people were noticing the symptoms. Cheers, Dan.

To: Lane3 who wrote (3244)	1/18/2001 12:26:31 PM
From: cosmicforce	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 6089

I had thought the lefties laid claim to the high moral ground I am a relativist. I don't believe that there is a high moral ground. The thing is that the Christian Right is using completely different standards for their morality. In the secular world there can be no valid morality that doesn't come from God and the Bible, similarly as long as they BELIEVE they are acting in the name of God, THEY can't be thwarting God's will. People not driven by Christian dogma are not worthy of respect. We aren't talking about Fascists who believe that personal liberty can suffer merely for the good of the majority (though there is an element of that). We are talking about where the moral authority comes from. A lefty gets theirs from the wrong place - the secular world. Lefties believe that secular human values and consequences are the most important thing. They consider all people to be worthy of respect, irrespective of their lifestyle and personal actions (except when their is provable harm to others, and even then, as in the case of abortion, it is the parasitic nature of the fetus that represents the transgression of person). They also tend to minimize the importance of unity in thought and action, celebrating diversity. These positions are irreconcilable. There can be no consensus or finding a middle ground without one side or the other feeling they are selling out.