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To: Scumbria who wrote (127175)	2/12/2001 12:03:50 PM
From: Elmer	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 186894

Re: "P4 is a mediocre design at best. Intel is going to need more ammo than they have got, to hold off AMD this year. K7 is a better product for most apps" P4 outperforms Athlon by a dramatic margin when running modern code, and the GHz rocket is just starting to take off. EP

To: Scumbria who wrote (127175)	2/12/2001 12:13:45 PM
From: fingolfen	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 186894

I disagree... The only thing hampering the P4 at this point is the lack of SSE/SSE2 optimized software. Since even AMD is going to SSE for their K8 series... it's only a (short) matter of time until more optimized software is out there. With SSE optimization, the P4 mops the floor with the K7... my real interest is on SSE optimized software, how will the K8 and P4 compare. AMD's pretty much stuck at 1.2 GHz with the K7, although the new core will give them a little more life. Intel's been stuck at 1GHz with the P3, although Coppermine may have a 1.13GHz in it, and Tualatin may go as high as 1.3GHz if they're lucky... but the days of the P3 and K7 are nearing an end... The K6 was really more a generation 5.5 CPU, just like the K7 is really more a generation 6.5 CPU... the P4 and K8 are true seventh generation new architectures... Furthermore, as the die size of the P4 shrinks, there will be silicon real estate to reverse some of the compromises made in its original design (if there is a competitive need). The P4 is a far more visionary design than the K7, although I'll grant you some compromises were made for the sake of pushing the envelope. Bottom line is in a year the K7 is going to be puffing and blowing compared to the P4, which will only then be hitting its stride with new optimized software... Looking to the future of the P4... we know that it moves to 0.13 micron with a chip called "Northwood." There are changes from "Coppermine" P3's to "Tualatin" P3's according to various sites around the net... so Intel apparently didn't just do a dumb shrink of the coppermine to make the Tualatin... What changes will be incorporated into the Northwood core. Some sites (which unfortunately seem to revolve around The Register) have also mentioned another code name, "Prescott." Does anyone know if this is another P4 revision or if it's an IA-64 product??? The bottom line for me is this... If AMD's competitive position is so far superior to Intel's, then why are selling their top-of-the-line chips for under $300, whereas Intel can command over $700 for theirs??? Contrary to popular myth, AMD is a corporation out to make money. The driving force in a capitalist economy is to maximize profits... AMD clearly isn't doing that if your hypothesis is correct... so, "something's out of joint..."

To: Scumbria who wrote (127175)	2/12/2001 2:05:19 PM
From: Paul Engel	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 186894

SCUMbria - re: "Merced has been out there for years, and no product. " Well, some people expect big things from Merced/IA64 in the years to come. biz.yahoo.com Monday February 12, 7:04 am Eastern Time Press Release Itanium Architecture to Command 42% of Server Revenue by 2005 Aberdeen Report Analyzes Deployment of Intel's 64-bit Itanium Architecture BOSTON--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Feb. 12, 2001--In a report released today, Aberdeen Group, a leading provider of technology market consulting and research, states that Intel's Itanium architecture will be the foundation for 42% of all worldwide server revenue by 2005. Systems based on the Itanium architecture will be broadly deployed starting in the first half of 2002 and will span a wide range of operating systems -- including 64-bit Windows, IA-64 Linux, HP/UX, and AIX 5L -- and application environments. ``Intel must successfully roll out a replacement for its IA-32 architecture in order to remain an industry leader,'' says report author Gordon Haff. ``Database, business intelligence, and technical/scientific applications increasingly require a high-performance, balanced 64-bit architecture, but buyers also have expectations of the lower pricing that the widespread adoption of Intel processors has driven in the past.'' Intel's deployment of the Itanium architecture is more complex than megahertz and chip shipment dates. The market adoption of Itanium will be determined by the successful interplay between processor-centric details and Itanium's complex multi-vendor ecosystem of interdependent hardware, software, and services. The report, entitled ``Evolving Itanium into the Enterprise,'' offers an analysis of key business and technical dynamics and uses primary market research to forecast the overall growth rate for Itanium-processor-based servers by operating system environment. Profiled suppliers are Compaq Computer Corporation; Dell Computer Corporation; Fujitsu Limited; Groupe Bull; Hewlett-Packard Company; Hitachi, Ltd.; Intel Corporation; International Business Machines (IBM); Microsoft Corporation; MigraTEC, Inc.; NEC Computers, Inc.; Phoenix Technologies Ltd.; SGI; Unisys Corporation; and VA Linux Systems. For more information about ``Evolving Itanium into the Enterprise,'' visit www.aberdeen.com or call (800) 577-7891. About Aberdeen Aberdeen Group is a leading provider of technology market consulting and research. Steeped in technology and armed with end-user field research, Aberdeen answers clients' critical business and technology questions in the context of the Internet economy and across the product life cycle. Founded in 1988, Aberdeen is headquartered in Boston, Massachusetts, and has research centers in Palo Alto, California; Ft. Collins, Colorado; and Amsterdam, the Netherlands. Aberdeen is located on the Web at www.aberdeen.com. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Contact: Aberdeen Group Lorie Nall (617) 854-5337, nall@aberdeen.com