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Politics : Sharks in the Septic Tank -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: cosmicforce who wrote (7349)	3/4/2001 3:46:55 PM
From: Lane3	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 82486

I just don't get a humane approach to people without extending it to all animals. To be fair, it can be hard to recognize suffering in other creatures. I have a lot of experience with cats. They hide their suffering really well. You often can't tell they're hurting until they're near death. It's hard, too, to know whether other creatures suffer. Does a worm suffer when cut in half? You end up with two worms. Maybe that's easier than childbirth. I used to be married to an avid fisherman. There was never a fishing pier or dock at which we didn't stop to chat with the fishermen. It would drive me crazy to see them catch little fish they didn't plan to take home and just leave them flopping around on the ground until they died. They'd say they didn't want to throw them back because the stupid things would just take the next bait and waste the fisherman's time. I couldn't stand to watch it and often nudged them back into the water. You'd think I had murdered their first born. My husband finally convinced (bullied) me that they weren't suffering. I still couldn't watch it. Karen

To: cosmicforce who wrote (7349)	3/4/2001 10:36:07 PM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

I would extend that (logically) to any life (form) that can experience suffering. Some years ago there were a series of experiments that attempted to show that plants feel pain. I don't know what happened to the research, and don't know of any organization that is committed to the ethical treatment of plants. OTOH, are we sure that plants don't suffer when they are harvested? BTW, I assume that ants and spiders feel pain when killed. But when they are in my house, in a place I believe they do not belong, I have no compunction about killing them. Outdoors, I leave them alone (except for carpenter ants nests); it's their home. But in my home, they die. Do you feel the same way? Or do you avoid killing even ants, spiders, cockroaches, etc. in your home?