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Politics : PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: J_F_Shepard who wrote (152320)	6/11/2001 9:37:21 PM
From: greenspirit	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 769670

J.F. you must have missed half the conversation. It was Bill who first put forth the message that those who believe in God are fools. I simply wondered why it was important for him to paint people who disagree with him in that light. But, now I've come to understand where he's coming from. And basically it comes down to seeing religion as the main culprit for worldwide wars and calamity. Seeing religion and its effect on the world wearing that kind of black and white lense, is simply bigotry to me. Each and every day some religious organizations helps feed and clothe a needy person, and helps in a thousand other ways create healthy communities across the world by promoting fellowship and love between all people. Nearly every charitable organization in America devoted to helping people was started by someone because of their deep spiritual calling. Often, these "servants of God" have spent an entire life-time in selfless devotion toward helping others. At times, some servants actually give up their life for their calling to serve God, and change what they believe is morally wrong. When examining great leaders like Martin Luther King, can you really separate the man and his vision, from the deep spiritual center it came from which gave him the courage to persevere, risking everything in the process? I don't believe so. So, the picture of religion in our lives is far from complete when you only see the negative aspects and ignore the positive ones.

To: J_F_Shepard who wrote (152320)	6/12/2001 10:30:15 AM
From: Johannes Pilch	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 769670

But what I don't understand is…. How come you have the universe "all figured out" while the rest of us idiots are struggling to come to terms with some reason for its existence. I think you short change the whole thing. Well now I don’t think I have ever claimed to have the universe “all figured out.” I claim there is One who in fact has it all figured it out. If you can help us dummies out, and I'm not just talking about the nonbelievers on this thread but very famous men and women throughout history, you will do a great service. There is not a thing I can do for you, and the famous men and women of history are generally dead. So it is really quite a hopeless matter in both cases. I ain't God. Perhaps you'll be kind enough to enlighten us. You can start by answering the same question I asked Watson, ie in your mind what does God look like? I keep asking this question and never get an answer. There is no point in my answering the question because it necessarily will fail to make any difference to you. The question is quite a bit of nonsense from your point-of-view and I am powerless to help you sense it. Nevertheless I will try and answer you. What does God look like? He looks like utter boundlessness, like anything, including nothing. Now that is as clear a description I can give you while I’m trapped within this body and while you are trapped within yours. Do you think (not believe) there is an afterlife......and your evidence is???? No. I do not think there is an afterlife. But I know there is. Evidence? In a manner of speaking I am staring right at it. Right this minute. And it is reasonable. It is the only way I could have ever believed in a god. Ridicule me if it helps you sleep. I tell you something in me has a foot placed in a spiritual existence, such that I can now perceive that world clearly enough to live for it.