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Politics : Sharks in the Septic Tank -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lane3 who wrote (20558)	8/3/2001 7:10:00 PM
From: TimF	Respond to of 82486

weeklystandard.com

To: Lane3 who wrote (20558)	8/3/2001 7:37:43 PM
From: one_less	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

Nice post. I agree with your analysis. coupla comments (as always). "for consideration the notion that a somewhat lighter touch ..." Example: When my kids were three or so, I made it very clear that if you go wild in a public place (like a grocery store) we leave. Of course this is devestating to a three year old who likes these activities. It is also very hard on a parent to follow through on this. It could be a place you take you child to "have fun" or something. It is hard to stop the "fun" and leave, or to have to make another trip for the groceries. But my kids were really well behaved in public places, we had great times, and I believe setting these clear and firm guidelines had a lot to do with that. I felt awful when I would watch parents suffering through an episode where their child's behavior went more and more out of control as the parent, ignored them, made idle threats, or behaved badly themselves. A strong foundation in this case provided the opertunity for many light hearted and fun adventures for me and the kiddies. As they grow older of course there is a lighter and lighter touch on public behavior and social responsibility. However, the foundations or expectations (as when they were young) are clearly present. This may surprise you but they have no problem expressing and discussing their opinions with me. We have lengthy discussions on how things are in the world and where wisdom or principle might weigh in. I have been up until dawn on many occassions...no raised voices, just lots of talking things out. They often bring things up that I have no experience with and we explore together. They know and I know that I have zero control on behavior except through any respect they may now have for the foundations laid up to any given point. Adolescents by nature have to look outside the family circle to make determinations about what will work for them in adulthood, but to make a healthy transition they need that safety net you spoke of. It is wonderful when everybody is feeling like best buddies and these times do occur. However, teens or young adults quickly loose respect for a parent who goes along with their impulses and whims in order to keep the buddy feeling going. They've got buddies, they need also to have someone who will tell them the hard truth when they are struggling. Its no fun and in some cases could be just ignored but just as in the case of the out of control three year old, the rest of our lives may be the better for it. A real adult friend who loves them would, but most teens just have the buddies that help their popularity. My parents weren't perfect either, nor am I as parent; my kids teach me that continuosly (wouldn't have it any other way). "since you commented on it, my reporting that I once threw a hamburger at my father. I remember reading that but I think it was somebody elses comment.

To: Lane3 who wrote (20558)	8/3/2001 8:58:23 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 82486

I have embraced the concept that I set up rules, some of which will be broken, in order to give my children the chance- as teenagers- to break with me, and to disobey in order to separate from the parental "womb." I keep the rules tight so the disobedience need not be life threatening in order to make a statement. I don't keep the rules tight necessarily because I agree with the rules absolutely (as you know I am a relativist), but in order for the rules to work I must appear to embrace them. UGH No one ever said parenting would be easy. It appears to me that children must break from their parents in order to establish their own identities. I don't want my children to live out my dreams, I want them to find their own dreams.And I think that disapproval plus unconditional love is a good recipe for a parent to follow. Although I try to keep the disapproval to reasonable things- like drinking, and tattoos, and drugs, and unhealthy lifestyles. I don't want to tell my kids what political persuasion to be, or whether to be religious or not, or tamper with their internal sense of their sexuality (as opposed to sexual behavior), these things I consider intensely personal, and while I think information and open dialog on these things is appropriate, I won't do more than that.