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Pastimes : No Mideast Oil Products - A petition -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: schrodingers_cat who wrote (106)	10/16/2001 4:31:53 AM
From: DOUG H	Respond to of 280

Points 5 and 6 show that the writer of the letter is ignorant of the fact that there is a world oil market. It doesn't matter wether our oil comes from Iran or not. If the Iranians stop producing, and nobody makes up the difference, then the price of oil for all consuming countries will go sky high 5 & 6 cover your concerns, here they are for your re-review. 5. Support for the purchase from, and aid in, the development of the oil production capacity of the nations which are assisting us in the current conflict, particularly those in the former Soviet Union. At present we do not buy any oil from Russia, Uzbekistan, or Turkmenistan, which are certainly worthy of our support. 6. Reduce oil imports from hostile nations, such as Iraq and Iran.

To: schrodingers_cat who wrote (106)	10/16/2001 5:01:20 AM
From: Jorj X Mckie	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 280

The original purpose of this thread, and it is still stated in the thread header, was to send a letter/petition to the oil companies stating that we didn't want to use petroleum products that come from states that sponsor/support terrorism and additionally, practice human rights abuses as a matter of course. Here is the relevant text from the thread header. ======================================================== This thread came about through some discussions on the "Piffer Thread on Political Rantings and Ravings" thread: Subject 37386 as well as some parallel discussions on "Foreign Affairs Discussion Group" Message 16507632 I believe that the lack of support and disrespect from the Saudis deserves a response that they can understand. A message that delivers the message "if you don't want to join the civilized world, you can take your oil and give yourself an enema with it". If you are in support of sending a letter to our oil companies that basically states "The first Oil Company that offers Mideast Free Oil, gets our business", Please add your alias to the list (not your real name, if there is enough interest, I will pursue a more formal route). This thread can also be used as a discussion point for what the message should actually be. When adding your name to the list, please cut and paste the entire list and add yours at the bottom. Please go to the last posting of the list to add your name. ========================================================== the addition of the message for the government representatives happened somewhat later than the original creation of the thread and is more of an aside. I outlined some of the major points in this message: Message 16508889

To: schrodingers_cat who wrote (106)	10/16/2001 10:34:30 AM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 280

Thank you for your comments. As your own data demonstrates, petroleum is, indeed, used to generate electricity. 1 million barrels per day is 5% of our daily consumption of crude oil, which I believe to be significant in light of the fact that we only import 13.5% from Saudi OPEC as it is. If we quit consuming petroleum for electricity generation, that would be cancel out the amount that we now import from Iraq. You are correct that research is already ongoing for all technologies we listed - but reality is that these technologies are not ready for commercial use. A crash course in energy independence is called for, now. Scientists have been trying to make cheap oil from coal since the early part of the 20th century. You may believe it can never be done any cheaper than it already is - but I prefer not to listen to those who say "it cannot be done," because I know that usually people who say it cannot be done are wrong. As for not knowing that there is a world market - well, thanks for telling me. I used to work at Exxon, and my husband is a chemical engineer who worked for the SPR (Strategic Petroleum Reserve). ;^)

To: schrodingers_cat who wrote (106)	10/16/2001 11:55:28 AM
From: Sam Raven	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 280

Exactly......There is not a alternate fuel comparable to oil, oil comes with the energy build in, for example, we are still trying to decide whether it takes more energy to make ethanol than the energy it produces when you use it. While I recognize all the good intentions regarding the effort to avoid using ME oil are well meaning, these good intentions make us feel good and politically sell well, but that is about it. We don't live in a vacuum, oil we don't use will go somewhere else in the world and we will compete with those folks. Oil will not rot in the ground, it will be used, with someone benefitting from that use. And, we will not effect ME policy by disengaging, nor will that keep us from being attacked. Lastly, when we buy oil from the ME they know they had better put that money to constructive use, at some point the oil runs out, and sand has little food or energy value. When they do put that money to use, it comes back here. Lastly, while this country is the largest consumer of energy, we are the healthiest, have the cleanest environment and have the capital to solve our environmental problems. Let the price of oil control our demand, if we have environmental problems as a result of our use we need to build solving that problem into the price of its use. Our best defense is to keep an open mind and maintain the innovative spirit that makes this country and economy great. Sam savvy-trader.com

To: schrodingers_cat who wrote (106)	10/16/2001 3:53:25 PM
From: Dave	Respond to of 280

The government already spends plenty of money researching alternative energy... Bzzzt, wrong. Reagan slashed that budget by NINETY PERCENT! When did this "plenty of money" come about? And by how much did Bush Jr propose to decrease that (in the purported name of, uh, making more money for Oil Companies, I guess)? Dave