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Pastimes : Understanding Islam -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: HG who wrote (365)11/4/2001 8:11:32 PM
From: IN_GOD_I_TRUST  Respond to of 2926
 
HG,

I liked your post. It was filled with a lot of constructive emotion and well states many feelings of others I have talked to about this current situation.

Your opinion was very well stated, and I, for one, appreciate your point of view.

Thanks,
Steve



To: HG who wrote (365)11/4/2001 9:43:23 PM
From: uu  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 2926
 
Dear HG,

Your post is perhaps one of the most intelligent posts I have read in a long time. I sure hope many who are seeking some way to express what is inside of them hurting them so much with all that has happened during this difficult time read it, and it may make them feel better that they are not alone out there. There are so many - so many - people who are simply (as you stated) tired of being kicked around in the name of religion, and evil that is happening and is kept hidden for the political correctness of the time.

My good friend IGIT, on his very post here on this thread said something that was very profound. He responded to my questioning of some Islamic aspects, and I was trying very hard to phrase them in a rather ploitical correct framework, so I would not be hurting anyone's feeling. He basically said if we all accept the truth - as they truly are - without trying to dance around them, things would work out and everything will fall in its place for the better.

Thanks so much for your very intelligent post.

Regards,



To: HG who wrote (365)11/5/2001 1:16:11 AM
From: soroush  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 2926
 
HG,

Excellent post. Reading your post reminds me of why I wanted to pay $200 to join SI and I am very glad I did!

Sincerely,

Soroush



To: HG who wrote (365)11/5/2001 10:01:25 AM
From: Shaw  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 2926
 
From what I understand the Sufis are the sweet side of the Moslem faith. They follow the inner path of Divine love. As true mystics they know this love finds no boundaries. This is the high pure love that is experienced by all religions. From what I understand the Moslem faith split in two directions after the poisoning of Mohammed and the assassination of his chosen successor his nephew Ali. The ones that were responsible for the killing directed believers to help them spread the message of the Koran by conquest, while the others choose the path of Divine love and went underground. Unfortunately the more hard headed many Moslems remain, the more suffering the worlds is going to experience. It doesn't have to be this way though. These militaristic clerics are an abomination to the sweetness of God. Mohammed had the task of trying to lead an extremely violent pagan tribal society toward the concept of the one God and his divine consciousness. Mohammed had to be very strict to counteract the tribal habits and particular brand of violent warring tribal behavior that was found in Arabia at the time. But Mohammed was pure and fair and balanced is his use of power. All Mohammed’s wars were purely defensive and in the end he was treacherously killed by his own people, that he had a come to lead out of their ignorance. Mohammed worked to have the station and respect for women raised. He would have done more but you can only raise the consciousness of man so much in any given age. It seems the world is going to have to work very hard to raise the current consciousness of fundamentalist Moslems. So apparently this has become the work of our time, to fight the very same ignorance Mohammed was. In time the violent fundamentalist will go the way of the wind, for already they harbor the seeds of their own destruction in their very midst, for over half their population harbors some hatred towards them, that being their women. Maybe that is where we should focus are energy, by reaching out to the hearts and minds of these miss treated women. No wonder these fundamentalist don't want their women educated. Well sorry Mr. intolerant fundamentalist out their, we can't ignore your criminal behavior any longer. Doing it in the name of God means your in further trouble, after you die, but in the meantime you have become the world's problem, we can no longer ignore your criminal actions and just hope they go away on their own. The world can meet this challenge, the world has the higher moral ground and more strength, its just a matter of time. If the world has to be firm and strict to meet this challenge, as Mohammed was, so be it, but I as one World citizen still will always support the free play of Divine love where ever it chooses to flow, through out the world, God knows no boundaries or distinctions, but his love flows in any receptive heart. As a world citizen, I try to respect and gain more understanding of all. In trying to nourish ones own inner path, don't forget that the priest or preacher or mullah or cleric or rabbi is not God and as such is limited in wisdom. And of course if they love power, they are serving two Gods. Listen to the mystics of the ages, the truly holy and humble like St. Francis, or Rumi or Hafiz theirs is the path of pure love, which is the path of the truly strong and balanced.



To: HG who wrote (365)11/5/2001 2:15:26 PM
From: trouthead  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 2926
 
I have also enjoyed your posts HG. Thanks. I do think that one of issues that gets missed is why the muslims are incited to wage war. As we've seen from history people of all religious persuasions, all of which teach compassion and non-violence, can be incited to rise up and vanquish a perceived foe. So I don't think that the violence can be specifically laid at the feet of the prophet. I think this point gets overlooked because in a broad sense it implies that the US brought this on themselves and this sentiment is interpreted as unpatriotic.

I do not think we deserved what happened on sept. 11th and I think the perpetrators must be stopped. I also know that the US does not have clean hads when it comes to the middle east. But what I think doesn't matter as much as what the muslim community thinks. They have a list of grievances. A list that in their mind justifies the killing of westerners. An interesting discussion would be on the merits of their grievances.

We have the creation of the Israeli state. The conditions in Iraq. American soldiers in Saudi Arabia. The Shah of Iran and the other puppet regimes that we have supported.

I am sure others could list more. I do not know enough about the history of the region to comment intelligently on any of them. I am a simple american gardener who loves to dig in the dirt. I post this message in hope that others who are more knowledgeable will comment on the various problems of the middle east and the role the US has played.

Thanks,
jb