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To: Raymond Duray who wrote (42179)	11/29/2003 6:33:01 PM
From: Snowshoe	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 74559

Quite a switch from the good ol' days when Nixon/Kissinger ran the government and Trots peddled newspapers on street corners.

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (42179)	11/29/2003 7:21:34 PM
From: JF Quinnelly	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 74559

The connection is in the acolytes. And since Strauss is associated with his acolytes, his guilt is by association. Then there's Plato, who is venerated by Strauss, who's acolytes are Trots, ergo Plato is a Trot. Sort of.

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (42179)	11/29/2003 7:30:33 PM
From: glenn_a	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 74559

Raymond. Thank-you for the OpenDemocracy piece on Shadia Drury and Leo Strauss. Funny, but in the history of ideas, I hadn't come across Leo Strauss' name before - certainly not amongst any Existentialist reading. But it provides a philosophical continuity for what I see and hear in my current world ... it would seem, a modern philosophical framework on which to base, well, fascism. Never did buy the whole Nazism as primarily a German thing. Always seemed to me that events somehow chose German, Jewish, Gypsy, etc. peoples to play out roles whose possibilities are deeply rooted in the human condition. In different circumstances, the British could easily have acted as the Germans, and the French suffered the persecution of the Jews. And certainly there were individuals on all sides that acted according to principles of human decency or cruelty irrespective of the social climate. A fascinating read ... plan to look into this Strauss character a little more closely. BTW, for anyone who hasn't seen the GNN video "The Most Dangerous Game", its worth checking out: guerrillanews.com If you can't get the Windows video to work, try the QuickTime version. Also, the John Stauber video on propaganda is very good also: guerrillanews.com Best regards, Glenn

To: Raymond Duray who wrote (42179)	11/29/2003 7:50:10 PM
From: tom pope	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 74559

Man, Raymond, you are on a roll. I think I should put you on ignore lest you drag me into your camp <g> I think there are a lot of conservatives like me who wonder how the label got hi-jacked by the present crowd. I'd never heard of Strauss until today except as a composer of bombastic tone poems (and waltzes, but that may not have been the same Strauss). Accepting your interpretation of his advice to rule and lie, what happens when the lie blows up in your face (as it has in Iraq)? Is there any possibility of redemption? A return to a policy that understands that to further the interests of the United States an appreciation of the limits on U.S. power is essential? Damn, I think I'm becoming a Clintonite.