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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: one_less who wrote (167415)	7/27/2005 1:50:06 PM
From: el_gaviero	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

“1)We are in Iraq, which has little to do with what I want or don’t want it is a simple matter of fact. “ So, like, you see, I come upon this man who is raping this women, I mean, he is really socking it to her and she is screaming and carrying on and all --- but who am I to say that he should stop, because it has little to do with what I want or don’t want it is a simple matter of fact...... ”2)If we left Iraq under the current conditions there would be violent uprisings from tribal, political, fundamental, fascist, racist, and economic extremists.” (Returning to my own voice): yes, but the reason the current conditions are what they are is because we invaded. I think we should get out of Iraq (indeed, out of the Middle East especially including Israel), and let them sort themselves out. There is not one shadow of a doubt in my mind that they will do better without us and with us --- but THAT is not why I think we should clear out. I am even more certain that we will do better without them than with them, that is to say, that we will do better when our relations with them are icy, correct, distant and based on a prudent and sober assessment of our own interests.

To: one_less who wrote (167415)	7/27/2005 2:37:52 PM
From: neolib	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

2)If we left Iraq under the current conditions there would be violent uprisings from tribal, political, fundamental, fascist, racist, and economic extremists. The empathetic Muslims from around the world would take sides which involves at least 1.4 billion people. The secular interests from around the world would not let their interests be overlooked so they would take sides too. The blood bath that followed would make the holocaust of Nazi Germany look like a cake walk. That is reason enough for me to think it would be irresponsible and wrong. If we left Iraq, most the the insurgents cause would be gone. If civil war did break out, Iran would come in and help the Shia deal with the Sunnis with or without the Kurds help. Unfortunately, this is precisely what Bush does not want to see happen, so we are stuck in Iraq. IMO, the current Iraqi government will continue to cozy up with Iran diplomatically and more to the point, economically, so it is irrelevant anyway. We may as well leave sooner than later.