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To: energyplay who wrote (67191)	8/10/2005 3:15:17 AM
From: Elroy Jetson	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 74559

I don't think standardized testing results in higher levels of achievement. It has now been revealed, and covered by "60 Minutes" and scholastic journals, that the results of the testing regimen used, when Bush was Governor of Texas, was falsified to produce results which demonstrated an increase in scholastic achievement. Now I loved taking test, and I still do. But taking tests doesn't improve learning or comprehension. Testing is an efficient way to segregate student into different groups. I loved it when students were broken into classes by ability. Learning is a lot more fun and challenging when the stupid and ordinary students are not in the classroom. I assume it would be better for average students as they can receive more attention and progress at their own slower pace. .

To: energyplay who wrote (67191)	8/10/2005 5:08:37 AM
From: elmatador	Respond to of 74559

Concerning: "Raising teacher's pay doesn't produce better graduates to any effective degree in the United States." Neiher in Brazil either!!! "Hireing more teachers to reduce class size for K-6 does seem to produce better results, but at considerable costs." abandon universities on their to fare for themselves via paid tuition or other mechanisms. They should know the options since they hold all the knowledge. Invest the big % of the money in basic education "Testing and posting results has turned out to be pretty cost effective - but most teachers dislike it." No onder they dont like; they donlt want their performace to be checked. "Getting disruptive and very slow students out of mainstream class rooms helps, but the school administrators usually have to fight lawsuits and pressure from the "everybody's equal " lobby. Plus the ADA, Americans with Disabilities Act, and their associated legal parasites." O God. This one will paralyse whole down country!!! "Applying social pressure to most lower class parents also has positive results. Difficult to do in economically mixed schools, as middle class and rich parents will push back or sue or ridicule the efforts." Holy shit! Sending your own kids to private school works pretty well. Exactly waht Elmat has been doing. "For some people, home schooling can work well - already disproportionate admissions to Ivy league, West Point, etc. are home schooled." Yes, exaclty what Elmat did.

To: energyplay who wrote (67191)	8/10/2005 5:20:04 AM
From: TobagoJack	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 74559

This is in your capitalstool.com neighborhood ? :0)

To: energyplay who wrote (67191)	8/10/2005 9:19:01 PM
From: Seeker of Truth	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 74559

Hi EP, "Raising teacher's pay doesn't produce better graduates to any effective degree in the US" That's backed up by various studies by business school profs. The only thing is, these studies are done by intellectual prostitutes. Not only does the proposition defy common sense; I personally know several people who had to abandon their teaching careers because their family couldn't make ends meet. Bright people can make a better living than by teaching. Another matter: where was the experiment of raising teacher's pay(in real terms, inflation adjusted) ever tried on a decent scale? Nowhere that I've ever heard of. Here in Toronto, where education is well funded compared to the US, the press still trumpets a pay "raise" that just keeps up with inflation as TEACHERS GET BIG RAISES news. For every other good or service you get better by paying more but teaching is a bloody exception? Seeker