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Politics : PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Geoff Altman who wrote (716922)	12/5/2005 8:03:28 PM
From: ManyMoose	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 769667

The thing is, how do the 21st Century people deal with 10th Century behaviors on a national or cultural scale? If we reverted back to that era ourselves, we could just wipe them out and be done with it. I don't think anyone wants that to happen, and we have certainly risen above such thinking. We can't treat them like they belong in the 21st Century because they have no such concept to draw on. They don't have enlightened and inspired leaders like our founders. They are in big trouble, and so are we unless they make some changes that we can't impose on them. It's beyond my understanding why they persist in such archaic thinking when the evidence that they would benefit from change is all around them. I guess it's just a matter of who is in power and wants to keep it that way.

To: Geoff Altman who wrote (716922)	12/5/2005 8:13:58 PM
From: DuckTapeSunroof	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 769667

Re: [Time to grow up, Islam. Time to get into the 21st ccentury....] "If Islam doesn't grow up and become more tolerant of their own and others...." EXACTLY. That's what I have been saying for many months now. What helped the West develop into a pluralistic, religiously tolerant region was a long series of internecine religious wars. Out of the wars between Catholics and Protestants the Reformation emerged... and so many of the ideals of religious freedom, pluralistic states, and 'inalienable' human rights which so inspired our founding fathers. The Islamic world never had a Reformation, never rejected Theocratic rule, never had a popular appreciation for pluralism and respect for freedom or religion. (Although they had their chances at various times in history: the Mongols were initially quite tolerant of religious expression....) The civil war in Iraq (with Shiites, backed by Iran, on one side... and Sunnis, backed by neighboring Sunni dominated nations like Saudi Arabia and others) poses an opportunity for radical Theocrats and totalitarians on both sides of the Shi'a / Sunni schism to become discredited with their populations. When the ruin that religious fundamentalism can bring to people is made clear to the people, and the only choice left that stands a chance of improving their conditions is pluralism, and respect for differing beliefs... only then can the Islamic world truly advance into the 21st. century. We should NOT be standing in the middle of the civil war, having both sides take pot shots at us and use us to blame all their problems on, not be trying to halt the progress of historic tides.