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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: neolib who wrote (194156)	7/31/2006 7:16:19 PM
From: michael97123	Respond to of 281500

Regarding borders post WW2, germany lost its eastern portion to poland. Japan lost islands. As for the borders, what hawk will show you will be the best the pals can get. It doesnt matter if it not perfect. Hell they didnt like 47 borders or 66 borders. And with all due to respect, it doesnt matter what you or i think about the borders. Two nations vie for land--no one will be totally happy when they dont get either greater palestine or greater israel.

To: neolib who wrote (194156)	7/31/2006 7:19:56 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 281500

So why didn't the Allieds keeps significant portions of the Axis lands permanently. They did. Look at a map. Poland moved 200 miles westward after WWII. Did Germany get to keep the Sudetanland? How about East Prussia? How about Danzig?

To: neolib who wrote (194156)	8/1/2006 12:18:23 AM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Please point out any other attempt in the last 50-60 years to create a state by importing the vast bulk of the new populace without the willing consent of the vast bulk of the existing populace. And please point out that nearly 1 million Jews were forcibly thrown of various Arab countries and had no other place to go except Israel. And the odds are that the percentage of those Jews constituting Israel's total population is probably on order of 2-3 million (but that's just a guess). In effect, Israel became the Arab equivalent of a "concentration camp" permitting them to expropriate their property. As Nadine mentioned earlier, note that many former and current Israeli government officials are former residents of Arab countries, where apparently they are no longer welcomed. Who's fighting for their right to return? Please point out any other attempt in the last 50-60 years to create a state by importing the vast bulk of the new populace without the willing consent of the vast bulk of the existing populace. Gosh.. how come you're limiting it to the last 50-60 years? But Iraq is probably a good example, where Kurds were forcibly evicted from areas they have inhabited for centuries, and encouraged Arabs to move in. All for the purpose of increasing the Arab "authority over the Kirkuk oil fields. And then there are the Coptic Christians of Egypt, who constitute 10% of that countries population and can trace their history back hundreds of years prior to the Arab invasions. Yet, Egypt is considered an Arab country.. In fact, it's officially called the Arab Republic of Egypt. And Copts remain an oppressed segment of Egytian society to this day. And then there is Tibet, where the Chinese have transplanted hundreds of thousands of Chinese (many of them soldiers) into Tibetan territory: tibet.ca As for a link to the proposed final status proposal in 2000, I found this link (and bookmarked it). mideastweb.org Note that it does not "balkanize" Palestine (except for Gaza). It provide contiguous borders (with a bit of "gerrymandering" near Jerusalem due to Israeli settlements). And there's no reason, were the Palestinians to show themselve to be as tolerant to welcome Jewish citizens, as Israel is to Arab citizens, that those Jewish settlements can't be later negotiated and tranferred to Palestinian sovereignty. Hawk Hawk

To: neolib who wrote (194156)	8/1/2006 2:37:32 AM
From: Elroy	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

I have never seen ANY map of the West Bank from ANY of these agreements that I would accept either. Could you provide a link to one that you think is reasonable? If you include Israel, the West Bank and Gaza strip in one unified country, it looks great on the map. It requires granting citizenship to the Palestinians and having Israel be the homeland of the people of the Levant, not just the Jews, and renamed to have a name with unifying implications rather than divisive religious implications.