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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: epicure who wrote (41186)	9/9/2007 9:33:08 PM
From: JohnM	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541429

You can say that, but most of the liberal battles have been won, imo- and the country is just getting more tolerant all the time, and more leftist :-) I agree on the social side, but as I typed in my post to Sam, I think the political culture slides right/conservative. Women's right to choose grows more endangered; the safety net is, while not shredded, certainly frayed with the momentum on privatization of everything; the tax cut mantra is still the dominant one so we continue down the debtor nation slope (not exactly conservative but Reagan managed to secure it for the conservatives); political programs to correct discrimination are on the defensive; etc. Perhaps the cultural drift you see will worm its way into the political culture more vigorously. And it might if the early primaries include more large states. Wonderful posts.

To: epicure who wrote (41186)	9/9/2007 9:34:01 PM
From: NAG1	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541429

Iktomi, I feel that the country is slightly left of center. Just my take on things. What I do find interesting is that many of the social programs so many depend on come from liberal ideas but it is hard to hear how many, who depend on these programs, think of liberal as a dirty word. I do think we lose perspective when we classify ideas as liberal or conservative so we can dismiss them out of hand. I would rather the discussion be based on the merits of the ideas proposed, not how someone classifies(or demonizes) them. I found it very revealing when, during Clinton's first term when HC was doing the health care reform and there were several polls which asked about HC's plans and most did not like them but when asked about individual ideas(most of which were in HC's plans), they were resoundingly popular. In my mind, the most important thing for Clinton's presidency was the fact that he lost the Congress in '94. It forced him to rule from the center and he was very successful there. I often feel that Bush's biggest problem was that he had no check in Congress(until this past year) to keep him from doing some of the lame brained things that he has done. Neal

To: epicure who wrote (41186)	9/10/2007 8:49:15 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541429

:-) Interesting story- and one which helps explain (partly) this administrations odd intransigence on Iraq: Homo politicus: brain function of liberals, conservatives differs by Marlowe Hood Sun Sep 9, 1:33 PM ET PARIS (AFP) - The brain neurons of liberals and conservatives fire differently when confronted with tough choices, suggesting that some political divides may be hard-wired, according a study released Sunday. Aristotle may have been more on the mark than he realised when he said that man is by nature a political animal. Dozens of previous studies have established a strong link between political persuasion and certain personality traits. Conservatives tend to crave order and structure in their lives, and are more consistent in the way they make decisions. Liberals, by contrast, show a higher tolerance for ambiguity and complexity, and adapt more easily to unexpected circumstances. The affinity between political views and "cognitive style" has also been shown to be heritable, handed down from parents to children, said the study, published in the British journal Nature Neuroscience. Intrigued by these correlations, New York University political scientist David Amodio and colleagues decided to find out if the brains of liberals and conservatives reacted differently to the same stimuli. A group of 43 right-handed subjects were asked to perform a series of computer tests designed to evaluate their unrehearsed response to cues urging them to break a well-established routine. "People often drive home from work on the same route, day after day, such that it becomes habitual and doesn't involve much thinking," Amodio explained by way of comparison in an e-mail. "But occasionally there is road work, or perhaps an animal crosses the road, and you need to break out of your habitual response in order to deal with this new information." Using electroencephalographs, which measure neuronal impulses, the researchers examined activity in a part of the brain -- the anterior cingulate cortex -- that is strongly linked with the self-regulatory process of conflict monitoring. The match-up was unmistakable: respondents who had described themselves as liberals showed "significantly greater conflict-related neural activity" when the hypothetical situation called for an unscheduled break in routine. Conservatives, however, were less flexible, refusing to deviate from old habits "despite signals that this ... should be changed." Whether that is good or bad, of course, depends on one's perspective: one could interpret the results to mean that liberals are nimble-minded and conservatives rigid and stubborn. Or one could, with equal justice, conclude that wishy-washy liberals don't stick to their guns, while conservatives and steadfast and loyal. As to the more intriguing question of which comes first, the patterns in neuron activity or the political orientation, Amodio is reluctant to hazard a guess. "The neural mechanisms for conflict monitoring are formed early in childhood," and are probably rooted in part in our genetic heritage, he said. "But even if genes may provide a blueprint for more liberal or conservative orientations, they are shaped substantially by one's environment over the course of development," he added. Obscuring causal links even more is the fact that the brain is malleable and neural functions can change as a result of new experiences.

To: epicure who wrote (41186)	9/10/2007 11:30:29 AM
From: Steve Lokness	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 541429

Iktomi; The center is drifting- and it is drifting left, imo. Go ahead and argue against that- but I'd like to know on what you might base Left? Have you been to Europe? Now that is left - socially. As to hippies - what have we gotten that they have proposed? Free love and drugs? Hardly. I think in just about every category the country has moved to the right. Sure can't argue that the country has moved to the right as far as the military machine and foreign intervention is concerned. Sure can't argue that the country has moved to the right as far as economic measures in this country are concerned. The rich are getting richer and there is less and less responsibility - less government over sight as the little man and the working man is screwed. The working man pays 30% on his wages while the flim flam man pays 15% on his wages. ......Socially: Hardly any improvement there as we are moving backwards on a womans right to choose. Gays; hardly any improvement there as witnessed by the Craig comment. I am not gay, i am not gay! Drugs; hardly as witnessed by our prison populations. Freedom of religion; hardly as the Christian fundamentalist movement is as strong as every. Science; we are doing nothing on global warming - nothing other than talk. On evolution vrs creationism - our friends in Europe are laughing at our belief in ID. Gun control; not even an issue anymore, when was the last time you heard anyone talk about that? Most of our important environmental laws were made under Nixon and his administration, they are constantly being chipped away at. Now, where do you see any meaningful movement to the left? Hillary is more centrist than perhaps any democrat in recent years. The center is not moving left it is moving right! I look forward to your comments. steve