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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: TimF who wrote (52977)	3/11/2008 1:02:35 PM
From: Steve Lokness	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542253

Tim; The productivity increase in manufacturing has been occurring for a long time, its massive, and its nearly universal across the world Gawd what a defeatist attitude. Let's just all lay down in the road and wait to get run over. ..... The manufacturing at Deere and Cat and Boeing is going great! So is the manufacturing of oil/mineral extraction. So is the manufacturing in the health care industry - MRI's and the likes. We all need and will always need Manufactured goods. We can be the world leader - especially in things such as robotics, healthcare and alternate energy - but it will take a mindset that appreciates the NEW opportunities. That is what has been the problem under republican leadership - they have relied on the old ways and old ideas. That by the way is the definition of a "republican". Look it up. steve

To: TimF who wrote (52977)	3/11/2008 9:35:56 PM
From: neolib	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542253

Countries that have a net positive balance of trade in manufactured goods such as Germany and China, have also experienced declines in manufacturing employment. Sure, but you might want to look at the difference between a net positive balance of trade and a net negative balance of trade country's manufacturing employment. Here it is, please note the graph footnote, this is not just manufacturing, but industrial output. It does look like the slopes are similar, but the % of employment in industry & manufacturing for Germany & Japan vs the USA is pretty astonishing. Of course, this does not prove it is soley because of net exports, but I suspect it is largely so. (Per the BLS, in 2006 the combined total for farmers, ranchers, and agricultural managers was 1.6 million people Is the above for real? Who in the heck would use such a statistic, assuming it is for real? The comparable statistic for manufacturing would be business owners and managers. Is that any sort of useful statistic for manufacturing employment? Why would farmers, ranchers and ag managers be a useful statistic for ag employment? The idea that services have grown faster in the US because less of them are imported is to say the least a very questionable assertion. LOL! Then why not produce some numbers to back that up. I already gave you some showing the fraction of trade imbalance in manufacturing to the total US manufacturing. See if you can generate a similar number for services. Manufacturing is WAY more exposed to foreign competition than services. To claim otherwise is a joke. Please don't resort to anecdotal examples. I'm well aware that there are such examples. Look at the aggregate numbers. And look at doctors, then look at the increase in medical costs. Your examples, doctors, lawyers etc. are all good candidates as examples of Yes, anything which requires one on one service. But in the case of doctors, technology has helped them as well, and the care we get has gone up greatly as well. So there might actually be reasonable productivity growth there, if you consider quality. Lawyers are another story... Now to the extent that the fact that we spend more on doctors, teachers, lawyers, police, fireman, bureaucrats, etc., because we produce more in other areas (and are thus wealthier) its less of a problem, but it is still a problem, esp. because many of these areas involve government services, and higher prices here amount to and expansion of government. California is a good example. Your average Bay Area house that sells, will generate 5-10K/year in tax revenue for the local cities and counties. That lets them pay fireman and school bus drivers 100K/year. Life seems great until the city or state files for bankruptcy