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To: koan who wrote (95724)3/25/2009 7:59:31 PM
From: Claude Cormier4 Recommendations  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 116555
 
-You just do not seem to understand "we are the government"!

Clearly, we are not the government. We elect it but that is all. Once elected, governments do what they need to do in order to get re-elected again and again.

First let me say again that I am not against the presence of a government and some form of democracy. I am against big governments.

Governments become big because the voters ask more and more from them. Most of the voters do not understand economics. They vote for the party that promise the most for their own benefit. They vote, possibly inconsciously, so they can delegate some of their responsibilities to the authority in place. In the end, almost everything becomes the responsibility or the fault of the government. Voters are never at fault.

This causes the government to constantly intervene in all ways of life. That is why we are where we are now.

You did certainly the right thing for your mother. This is the normal behavior of a good human being. We do not need big government to be good human beings.



To: koan who wrote (95724)3/25/2009 9:27:06 PM
From: Little Joe5 Recommendations  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 116555
 
"This tribe is a democracy and has priority over individual rights. "

Does this apply to court enforced gay marriage against the will of the people. Do the people or the Courts have the right to decide whether abortion is legal and under what circumstance. What about the myriad Liberal Supreme Court Decisions which have overturned democratically enacted laws.

"When a person goes to a "charity" they often have to trade their dignity for that charitable contribution. It is bad enough receiving welfare and food stamps. Say if you are struck by a car and renedered paralyzed."

Let me see how this works. If in a time of extreme need I accept freely and voluntarily given charity, I should be ashamed, but if I take money forcibly extracted from taxpayers I am proud? Huh?

"You, Claude Cornier, have an obligation to your tribe. Not on your terms, but on the tribes terms"

In other words in your view he is the slave of the majority.

I lean toward the notion that we are "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

I really never thought of myself as a slave required to submit to majority will, or is that mob rule.
I suppose that is a liberal idea?

lj



To: koan who wrote (95724)3/25/2009 9:35:40 PM
From: John Metcalf  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 116555
 
Koan, I don't think there is anyone here who argues personal choices/values with you. I'm glad to hear you honored your obligation to the tribe by caring for your mother. My father-in-law spent his last 3+ years with us, and if he were still alive, he'd still be in our home, and we (not Medicare) would still meet his every need. Like you and other board members, my wife and I make gifts and care for those in need.

I agree that civilization depends on mutual care of each other, and that we give to and take from the "tribe". But there are so many tribes we belong to! Voluntary organizations, special-purpose districts, churches, alumni associations, social organizations, neighborhoods, chambers of commerce, professional societies, affinity groups (SI, for example). In governance, we belong to precincts, townships, cities, counties, Congressional districts, states, and nations. According to my property tax bill, I also belong to a road district, grade school district, community college district, high school district, fire protection district, airport authority, library district, and conservation district (operates a water plant). I also contract with profit-making and non-profit companies for services that are public elsewhere -- trash removal, electric power, security, communications, and water distribution.

My perspective is that the smaller the district, the greater my potential input, and the greater my satisfaction with it. I am happiest with the groups I join or support voluntarily. Certainly, I belong to many tribes. The "tribes" I least prefer are the largest -- United Nations, international "defense" alliances, national governments, national associations, international companies. I don't understand nor agree with your focus on the Federal government as the pre-eminent source of services and protections.

Governments are at odds on various levels. Illinois, where Barrack and I live, has several lawsuits in progress contending that Federal actions have unnecessarily violated our State's prerogatives. There are countless disputes between local districts and the State and Federal governments over unfunded mandates. If I were in Alaska with you, I would probably appreciate relief from State taxation, with accompanying rebates, negotiated from oil companies by Your Brilliant Governor. Unfortunately, I live in Illinois, where your rebate comes from my higher energy cost, negotiated by a Venal Huntress/Former Beauty Queen/Sportscaster. Three generations ago, the Selmaville and Texico oil strikes made this (now impoverished) area rich, as Alaska is now.

I don't seek to persuade you to abandon your long-held beliefs, but please put them in perspective of the large range of what we need and what we give. I do ask you to understand that skepticism of Federal requirements is not irrational, selfish, nor inhumane. There are other, perhaps better, ways of taking care of our tribes' various needs. I don't assert that there is no need for regulation on state, national, and international levels; I contend that bigger units need to be constrained in purpose, limited in size, and focused on only those things that are essential to their charter/Constitution/mission.

I am not one to put old folks on the ice.