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Politics : A US National Health Care System? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: RetiredNow who wrote (14241)	3/9/2010 6:45:34 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	3 Recommendations Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 42652

1) if health care passes, then it will increase entitlements and deficits and 2) if health care passes, their chances in Nov go down, because Americans only remember success and what they get out of the deal No, the GOP believes 1 but not 2. The GOP actually thinks they will do better in November if Obamacare passes because they can run against Obamacare, which is, if you haven't noticed, unpopular. But they would rather it not pass because it will be so difficult to repeal. The first four years of Obamacare contain higher taxes and higher premiums with hardly any benefits. It is beyond sense to think that Americans will suddenly change their minds and like Obamacare by November if it passes. One measure of Democratic desperation is that they are now openly running on the platform that Americans are too dumb to know what's good for them.

To: RetiredNow who wrote (14241)	3/9/2010 8:14:46 PM
From: TimF	Respond to of 42652

1) if health care passes, then it will increase entitlements and deficits and 2) if health care passes, their chances in Nov go down, because Americans only remember success and what they get out of the deal. I think 1 is true, 2 is false. Most of the spending for these programs does not kick in for years, while the taxes kick in much sooner, so I don't think this will be quite as hard to repeal (only difficult to repeal not almost impossible), for several years. And more to your point I don't think most Americans (particularly Americans who aren't already supporters of the bill, and Americans who would have any decent chance of possibly voting for Republicans) would feel they have gotten enough out of it to lock the Republicans out of winning in the next election. If however the bill goes in to effect, and lasts awhile (starting to spend lots of money, then building up more and more of a special interest for that money), it would probably only be repealable if its a disaster as bad as the worst claims about it by its opponents. I think it will be bad, even very bad, but I think many of the ways its bad will not be easily seen, and I don't actually think it will be a disaster, at least not in the relatively restricted definition of that term that I'm using, so I think the programs and spending would be effectively locked in, subject to modification, or perhaps even to replacement by some other big group of government programs, but almost impossible to simply repeal, or to massively reduce; at least not if the US doesn't have some fiscal crisis, and/or unexpected strong turn towards libertarian thought.

To: RetiredNow who wrote (14241)	3/9/2010 10:50:02 PM
From: Peter Dierks	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 42652

I really loved this line: As such defiance suggests, this was no isolated slip of the tongue. The president, who promised in both word and style to usher in a “new era” of Washington “responsibility,” routinely says things that aren’t true and supports initiatives that break campaign promises. When called on it, he mostly keeps digging. Not only does Obama think that military personnel are Corpse Men (or just wishful thinking) but he thinks there are 57 states (probably got that from Kerry's wife). Even you have to be embarrassed to have such a profligate liar as the leader of your party. As far as OBama/PelosiCare it appears members of the Republican Party believe its passing will likely give them control of both houses of Congress. It will then be upon them to legislate an end to the unfair taxation without benefits. Once this economic crisis is past, Americans are going to be laser focused on that horrible debt and the unsustainable deficits. Yes, this will assure Obama a place as the most reviled Chief Executive of all time. I doubt if the current economic malaise will recede until his Administration has departed.