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To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 5:15:29 PM
From: freelyhovering  Respond to of 541104
 
This might be Adam Lanza's personality type:

en.wikipedia.org



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 5:31:10 PM
From: Tom C2 Recommendations  Respond to of 541104
 
I recommend this post. I don't own a gun and don't intend to own one but I can't imagine a law (that could pass) that would have made a difference here.



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 6:11:39 PM
From: SiouxPal  Respond to of 541104
 
Yeppers



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 6:28:49 PM
From: Sam  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 541104
 
I agree with you, Ed. And then I read about these wonderful teachers. The body of this story contradicts the subhead--the latter says, along with everyone else, that the mother taught at the school. But the body of the story says that she didn't teach there. The fog of war again?


Vicki Soto

Teachers sacrificed themselves to save their pupils
Four teachers murdered at Sandy Hook Elementary School all died heroes as they attempted to save their young pupils from a gunman they recognised as the son of one of the school’s kindergarten teachers.




Image 1 of 4
Lauren Rousseau had just landed a full-time teaching job at the school


By Sean Rayment
6:35PM GMT 15 Dec 2012


Authorities have identified principal Dawn Hochsprung, 47, school psychologist Mary Sherlach, 56, and 27-year-old Victoria Soto, a young first grade teacher, as three of the eight adults found dead at the Sandy Hook Elementary School on Friday.

A fourth teacher, Lauren Rousseau, 30, a substitute teacher who had been working at the school since October, was also reported to have been killed.

Twenty eight people died in the shooting spree, including 20 young children between the ages of five and ten. Six adults also died in the attack on the school.

It has been reported that Miss Soto sacrificed herself to save her students – throwing her body in front of the young children.

Some of the teachers took cover beneath tables when the murderer, Adam Lanza, opened fire inside the school in suburban Newtown, Connecticut – but the Mrs Hochsprung and Mrs Sherlach didn't hesitate, according to reports.

They ran into the hallway to confront the danger – and were murdered "execution-style" as a result.

It is understood that Lanza forced his way into the school past the newly-installed security system.

It was initially reported that Lanza's mother, Nancy Lanza had been a kindergarten teacher at the school, but staff later said they were not aware she worked there.

By that stage he had already killed his mother at the home they shared nearby with one of her guns and used her car to drive to the school.

Diane Day, a school therapist, told the Wall Street Journal that she and several other teachers were in a meeting with Mrs Hochsprung and Mrs Sherlach when the shooting began.

“We were there for about five minutes chatting and we heard, 'pop pop pop',” she said. “I went under the table.”

But the principal and the school psychologist ran toward the sound of the gunfire with complete disregard for their own safety.

“They didn’t think twice about confronting or seeing what was going on,” Ms Day said.

Rabbi Shaul Praver, who visited the scene, said that Mrs Hochsprung and Mrs Sherlach were killed in an "execution-style" shooting.

Miss Soto, who had taught at the school for five years was described by one of her deeply distraught 10-year-old pupils as ‘really nice and funny’, was trying to shield her students and usher them into a closet when she came face-to-face with the gunman.

Miss Soto’s cousin, Jim Wiltsie, said: “She put herself between the gunman and the children and that’s when she was tragically shot and killed.

“I’m just proud that Vicki had the instincts to protect her kids from harm. It brings peace to know that Vicki was doing what she loved, protecting the children and in our eyes she’s a hero," he added.

Jacob Riley added that Miss Soto liked to chew gum in class – something not usually allowed for teachers. He said he often teased her about her habit – and she playfully teased him back.

Former school superintendent John Reed told the Connecticut Post that Mrs Sherlach was warm and cared deeply for her students.

“If there ever was a person, by qualifications and personality, to work with children, to be a school psychologist, it was Mary," he said.

She was married, had daughters in their 20s, and enjoyed gardening, reading and the theatre, according to her school biography.

Mrs Hochsprung, who was happily married to her second husband after her first marriage ended in divorce, tweeted dozens of pictures of her school since the start of term earlier this year.

Friends and neighbours said it was immediately clear to everyone she knew that she loved her students and her school.

“I don’t think you could find a more positive place to bring students to every day," she told a local newspaper recently.

Lauren Rousseau, who grew up in the neighbouring town of Danbury, CT, had been due to go see The Hobbit movie on Friday night with her boyfriend Tony Lusardi III before going to a party. She had even made cupcakes with pictures of the actors in the movie attached to the top.

But she never returned from school - it is thought she was one of the teachers looking after the kindergarten classes targetted by Adam Lanza.

Miss Rousseau's mother Teresa, a copy editor at The News-Times newspaper. "It was the best year of her life," said Mrs Rousseau, describing her daughters happiness at getting a permanent position at the school this year.

"She had so many interests - music, dance, theatre."

"She was like a kid in many ways," added her father, Gilles Rousseau. "That's why she liked working with kids so much. She died with her little kids."

Another tale of heroism came from an eight-year-old student who said a teacher pulled him from the hallway as bullets rang out.

“I saw some of the bullets going down the hall that I was right next to and then a teacher pulled me into her classroom. It sounded like someone was kicking a door,’ he said.

Abbey Clements, also a teacher at the school, recalled how she thought the loud banging noises were caused by folding chairs falling over but she quickly realized that the sounds being transmitted over the school's PA system were in fact gunshots.

There were two students loitering in the hallway and Miss Clements and other teachers ushered them into her classroom for safety.

"My heart breaks for my little students who had to listen to those gunshots, they are going to have to work out their own trauma," she said, adding, "I couldn't stop those sounds from coming through the classroom."

The teacher only opened the door to her classroom once police officers had arrived at the school. The police escorted the children, some who were quiet and some crying, out of the school.

Fortunately, all of her students escaped unharmed and none had to pass by any causalities.

Kaitlin Roig, another teacher who survived the attack, explained how she kept her class safe by ushering them into a bathroom when she heard shots being fired.

"I said to them, I need you to know that I love you all very much and that it's going to be OK, because I thought that was the last thing they were ever going to hear," she added.

Mary Ann Jacobs, who worked as a clerk in the school library added: "The intercom went off and we could hear a kind of skuffle going in the office. I thought it had been set off by mistake so I called the office and the school secretary answered and said it was a shooting. As far as I am concerned she is a hero as she was right where it was happening.

"I yelled lock down in our room and ran across the hall to tell them to lock down too. We locked all the doors and covered the windows and got all the kids somewhere they cannot be seen. We told them to sit down and be quiet.

"We took them into a storage room at the back of the library where the servers are. We tore up bits of paper and handed out crayons to give the kids something to do.

"We were there for around an hour before people starting banging on the door saying they were the police. We didn't open the door for a while until they put a badge under the door."

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To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 7:20:26 PM
From: cosmicforce1 Recommendation  Respond to of 541104
 
<preventing this type of crime>

Short of institutionalizing the mentally ill and giving some respite for people who care for them - good luck with that!! The ACLU in conjunction with Regan White House (odd bedfellows, indeed) managed to let all these people run free, most to not become killers, but to become homeless. Certainly some ended up doing harm to others, but usually just to themselves.

Parents do the best they can and if they are single parents, what do they do when they shower, go to work, have sick time, doctors appointments (for themselves), social activities or other things that adults have to do? You can't expect them to supervise someone constantly and the law doesn't even allow parents to monitor their offsprings's (mental) health unless the child expressly permit permits it if they are 18 and over.
LINK: wordaroundthenet.com
,
Intentionally running over people has been done with some regularity. Certainly guns make killing easier but if you have been a cyclist, know that some people will intentionally run them off the road - doing everything from bumping , to reaching out windows to push them, or sneaking up on them and blasting the horn. All these potentially produce a fatal outcome that may or may not be documented as homicide.

According to one NASA scientist, 6% of drivers, of these 89% were SUV/truck drivers, intentionally tried to run over small animals that he put in the road. I knew a guy in the Navy that boasted about intentionally running over cats back in Phoenix where he grew up. He was a fundamentalist Christian as well and felt no compunction about it because "God gave us dominion over the animals." . He had a major stutter - I suppose he revolved the humiliation he received on the hapless animals that had the misfortune of being in front of him while driving. He was also suspected of turning in people who smoked pot though he didn't openly brag about this.

I just plugged in "intentionally running people over with car" to see what came up. A lot of incidents. Disturbing.



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 7:43:08 PM
From: neolib1 Recommendation  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 541104
 
I think you are making a fatal mistake in that analysis. A large fraction of our problem with guns is our love affair with them. The reports coming out now indicate the Mom was a gun nut. In a society with few guns (because of tough gun laws) there won't be as much fascination with them over time. Its something that can be changed only over time. You have to let the people who grew up romanticizing guns die off. Several generations of them.

But arguments like you are making will only insure that change never comes, so of course we will keep living with the results and wringing our hands about nothing being able to change anything.

Regarding bolt action, I also disagree. The hallmark of almost all these mass shootings is how inept the individuals are. I'm always amazed that the numbers are as low as they are. So given the ineptness, single-action of any sort would help greatly at reducing the carnage. Not the least of which is that in a crowd, someone with a bolt action will only drop a couple of people rushing him, and the third individual will smash his face in for him. Makes quite a difference in motivating the victims to mount a charge. Any sort of semiauto can preclude much chance of success unless the quarters are really close and the guy is ringed.



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 7:55:41 PM
From: epicure  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 541104
 
We can spend more time and money on the mentally ill. That's something both sides of the electorate should be able to agree on. One common denominator in these cases is mental illness- and we CAN do something about that. We can have more counseling available. We can have more help for parents of adults who are mentally ill. If you remember the pathetic story of Dahmer, one of the saddest things was that his father tried to get help for him, to no avail. It would not be panicky, impractical or silly to try to help the mentally ill more than we do. First, we will help the thousands of mentally ill (including many ex-service people) who are not going to harm anyone, and we might very well prevent at least some violence on the part of the very few mentally ill who are a risk to others.



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 7:59:14 PM
From: JohnM  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 541104
 
Greetings, Ed. You are mistaking the singular for the general here. And it's always the singular that seems to get the focus, rather than the general which can be addressed by policy.

At a minimum, the assault weapon ban that expired, I think in 2004, thanks to the Reps, could be reinstated. At a minimum, more care could be taken with the sale of guns--background checks required, and so on.

Nothing, of course, "solves" gun violence. And replying as if that's the point of my post is to severely misstate the issue in such a way as to dismiss the wanton availability of guns today.

And it misses the fact that states are passing bills permitting folk to carry unconcealed weapons in public, that some legislatures are looking at legislation barring schools from banning guns on the property, save those in the hands of security folk. And so on and so on.

I'm more than a little surprised that your argument is that nothing can be done. That's the way the NRA wins these arguments, you know. Everyone gives up.



To: cnyndwllr who wrote (211709)12/15/2012 10:22:28 PM
From: Cautious_Optimist1 Recommendation  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 541104
 
There is much that can be done, without taking reasonable guns away from sportspersons and hunters.

Closing the loopholes like those exploited online and at gun shows.

Banning big clips. Probably assault rifles, too.

Banning certain bullets.

No "stand your ground" exceptions that promotes vigilantism and arguably, a loophole for unconvictable murder.

Stopping the citizen's arms race seeded by ubiquitious concealed weapons...

End the movement to ban "no gun zones."

The second amendment says... regulated...

If you are one of those who believes high power firearms are necessary to defend against the Godless Socialist or Sharia Law army marching up your street to take you to FEMA camps; I have nothing much to say to you in the way of compromise.