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To: Grainne who wrote (13883)4/10/1998 9:37:00 PM
From: Dwight E. Karlsen  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 39621
 
re I am surprised that you do not even know that Jesus was a preacher in the smaller towns around a larger city in a place ruled by the Romans. They crucified him because he was a social activist, railing against Roman rule, knocking tables over to express his feelings, etc.

Christine, first of all, the tables turned over were in a Jewish Temple, which had nothing to do with Roman rule. Why do you say, "I am surprised that you do not even know that Jesus was a preacher in the smaller towns around a larger city in a place ruled by the Romans."? Did I say that Jesus wasn't a preacher? Of course I know that Jesus preached with freedom, authority, and power wherever he went.

But the thing you are mistaken in is this : the Romans cared little about the things which went on in Jerusalem or the surrounding smaller towns. In fact Christine, even though the Romans had a titular governing authority in Jerusalem, which was Pontius Pilate, the Roman courts dealt primarily with Roman citizens, and only intervened and acted as an appeals court when Jewish courts issued capital sentences of death. The Jews, on the other hand, were for all practical purposes the rulers of Jerusalem, and they did make laws and bring forth judgements for Jews. The Jews were not Roman citizens. It was the Jewish High Priests and Pharisees which Jesus railed against, NOT the Romans.

And in fact, Pontius Pilate, the Roman Governor in Jerusalem, DID NOT want to crucify Christ, and implored the people to allow Jesus to go free, and also Herod, the Roman Governor of Galilee, when Jesus was sent by Pilate to see Herod during his trial, the bible says of Herod: "And when Herod saw Jesus, he was exceeding glad: for he was desirous to see him of a long season, because he had heard many things of him; and he hoped to have seen some miracle done by him." When Jesus was sent back to Pilate, we see: "And Pilate, when he called together the chief priests and the rulers and the people, Said unto them, Ye have brought this man unto me, as one that perverteth the people: and behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him: No, nor yet Herod: for I sent you to him: and, lo, nothing worth of death is done unto him. I will therefore chastise him and release him." [Luke ch. 23, 13-16].

Christine, THREE TIMES Pilate implored the people to allow Jesus to go free, but the people demanded he be crucified, their hatred of him was so great. Pilate finally gave in to the Jews, and then finally the Roman soldiers took Jesus away to be crucified, for our justification. So you see, the Romans didn't crucify Jesus "because he was a social activist" at all. The Romans were simply appeasing the demands of the Jews in Jerusalem.

re Do you know that he was a Jew, and that the Christians were a small Jewish sect for hundreds of years?

Of course I know Jesus was a Jew, but Christians were NOT "a small Jewish sect for hundreds of years". Not very long at all after Christ's crucifixion and resurrection, the Holy Spirit was poured out onto the Gentiles also, and so the Christians became a mixture of Jews and Gentiles.




To: Grainne who wrote (13883)4/11/1998 12:16:00 AM
From: WTCausby  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 39621
 
Christine:

<<They crucified him because he was a social activist, railing against Roman rule,>>

Does this sound like someone "railing against Roman rule...?"

Matt 22:17-21
17 Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or not?"
18 But Jesus, knowing their evil intent, said, "You hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me?
19 Show me the coin used for paying the tax." They brought him a denarius,
20 and he asked them, "Whose portrait is this? And whose inscription?"
21 "Caesar's," they replied. Then he said to them, "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's."

Tom