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To: gdichaz who wrote (4226)	1/12/1999 8:58:00 PM
From: Jay Lowe	Respond to of 29970

>> ADSL does not compete well with cable Suggest not dismiss DSL ... see my DSL posts upthread: - ADSL deployments are moving quickly and competence is being displayed by at least some carriers and ISPs. - DSL Lite (1.5Mbps and less) does compare favorably with cable especially in those cases where DSO overload their segments and plant. - Full rate DSL (VDSL 7-10 Mbps) is gaining favor as more carriers install fiber-to-the-curb (optical into buildings) - Bell Atlantic's own numbers show that 40% of their subscribers are within full rate VDSL range. Following conversation from DSL reflector catches the essence ... >Subject: [xdsl] Re: All You Can Eat ADSL @ $39/Month >> How can this be? >> SBC is offering ADSL at $39.00 a month. >> Their Internet "subsidiary" ISP, PacBell Internet adds $10.00 a >> month to that. >> So, ___ fear of melting backbones may become a reality in >> California. Think of it-----$49 a month for "always on ADSL >> service! >> And, with those "greedy" 6 Mbps users, we're going to have >> melted glass all over California! >> My oh my----How can we stop this! >>> Dont need to. >>> >>> Pacbell will stop it to themselves when they saturate their NAP >>> connections and dont have the money to buy bigger connections. >>> (Pacbell's NAP connections are already creaking under load). >>>> After all, its happening _now_, to TCI's @home. They are >>>> throttling customers. 10mbps to the home at $40/mo >>>> doesnt pay the bills. >>>>> I believe it about customer acquisition. Worry about the >>>>> consequences later. This is what I mean about "Broadband Balloon Payment" ... For consumer use, DSL Lite and cable are about the same performance ... the real bottleneck does not lie in the last mile anymore ... it begins to move to the NAPs and backbone.

To: gdichaz who wrote (4226)	1/12/1999 9:26:00 PM
From: gdichaz	Respond to of 29970

Correction. Meant to refer to Ahhaha (spelling is not my strong suit - but then neither is knowledge of technology :-) ) - who is very savy here IMO and along with Frank help learners such as myself learn. Chaz

To: gdichaz who wrote (4226)	1/12/1999 9:58:00 PM
From: Frank A. Coluccio	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 29970

Chaz, thanks for those comments. I can't speak for the good Dr. AHhaha, maybe some day he'll let me without giving me a hard time (g), but I'm a perennial student of these disciplines, and if others choose to learn along with me, that's great. As for how I rate DSLs as opposed to CMs, that is a long discussion, actually several discussions, which I'd rather not treat lightly by picking a winner at this point in a short post. My belief is that fiber is now reaching the right price- performance- trajectory- horizon economics, with respect to the demand on that horizon, so that the service providers should seriously be thinking and planning in terms of deploying it to the residence soon. But they are not. There are hybrid measures that are emerging (but wont be out of the gate, probably, until it's too late) that may take up some of the slack when broadband hits the poles and the streets with all of its vengeance. But they may be too late in delivery to thwart the *eventual* stultifying effects that will ensue through the implementation of pervasive DSL offerings at this time - the onslaught which I think we are about to see. And too late to preclude the witting installation of soon-to-be inferior particular limited designs at this time of HFC. I've been run over too many times observing the "turnpike effect" to formulate a complacent attitude about this. Like I stated upstream, the extant (and even currently- being- implemented) HFC topologies that are now on the books will need to be optimized to reduce the number of contenders per segment. And if DSLs are to succeed AND do justice to users' expectations, they must in due time be 52 Mb/s VDSLs, emanating from pedestals at the curb. This is a very long series of discussions, and they will not be settled either in philosophical or practical terms here. Good Luck Tomorrow! Frank C.

To: gdichaz who wrote (4226)	1/13/1999 2:31:00 AM
From: ahhaha	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 29970

Every six months the DSL bogey shows up again. Frankly, I'm tired of beating that dead horse. I'll only say that companies like SBC are making a major error that will cost them to the extent of negative earnings if they get significantly involved in DSL. The DSL strategy is just a loss leader trying to keep the cable movement from forcing them to open their local markets. I have read here that PacBell is lowering their charge for 256/64 k service by $10/mo. This isn't their idea. They got this by command from SBC. At this price DSL is internally break even without factoring in the exponentially rising costs to linear scale. We won't even discuss the POTS net that breaks under the load from multiclient home LAN. Neither will we discuss new rulings from the FCC forcing the miscreants back into the process of forced local market opening which is developing under cable. ATHM is prepared for the great DSL revolution. They bought Northpoint for that reason, but I can see the new posters here aren't going to do the necessary work and read this thread to find out about this or why EDSEL is one of the great technological shams yet pushed by failed American tech companies. Every six months. Now let me get out my bogey list and see what is due next.