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Pastimes : SI Beta Site Launch - 7/01/99 -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 7:11:00 PM
From: Lizzie Tudor	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

I like the new SI better... For me the one negative is direct access to charts... accessing charts by setting up portfolios are kindof a hassle, and for that matter even getting to the portfolios aren't as easy as they were when they were right up there on the screen at the top.

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 7:53:00 PM
From: Sarkie	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 2340

I am another one that prefers the new site to the old. I tried the new site when it was first introduced but went back to the old mainly because of familiarity. Went back to the new site and now use it exclusively. I like the colors on the new site. Much more up to date, but then I am not fond of yellow and gray as on the old site. I would be very disappointed to see the site go to blue/gray. To me that is very cold. Color of steel, cold steel. It is not my decision, so I will not yell and scream about it. I truly do not understand the hulabaloo about the 'move this here, move that there' 'tweak this, adjust that'. The site was put up to weed out the bugs, not critique the design features. Yahoo did not ask for opinions when they changed their message boards, nor do the other sites on the net. There has been a tremendous amount of complaints on the new site, but most are by the same people, just reiterating the same complaint. I don't think the majority of complainers have taken in account the countless hours that have been put into the update, by a number of people. The biggest problem I see here, Silicon Investor opened the door way too wide by asking opinions. When you ask opinions from such a diversified group, you will get just as many answers. You can please some of the people, some of the time, but you cannot please all the people, all the time. ~Sarkie

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 8:01:00 PM
From: Jorj X Mckie	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

Jeff, There have been some rather amusing and insightful posts today. I'll assume that the reason that you responded to my messages was that it was both amusing and insightful<g> So, there is a mystery to be solved here. What is it about the new SI that is bothering people? I believe that the most fundamental negative is that it doesn't have the same look and feel as the classic SI. I am sure that somebody has given the Classic Coke analogy. Have you ever driven a car in England? Same functionality just doesn't feel right driving on the right side and shifting with your left hand. One of the things that Apple Computers understood was that people like a consistant user interface. When SI decided to change it not only changed the things that current members are accustomed to, but broke some expected conventions. Examples? Sure, I'll give a couple. When I want to perform a function in any application that I am using, I immediately focus my attention to the upper left corner of my computer screen. The most common command that I perform on SI is "next". The "next" command is on the left hand side of the screen now so when I go to the new SI I have to shift my thinking to the right hand side of the screen. To boil it down, there is no way to know intuitively where to focus my attention if I want to perform some sort of function. It goes beyond the example that I just gave though. You switched the "View Subjectmarks" and "Remove Bookmark" commands. Now the "Remove" is on the left and "View" is on the right. Which one do you think is selected more often? Which direction do your members think? (answers: "View" and "Left to Right"). The more frequently used command should be on the left. So, I would say that it isn't the complexity of the navigation that is the problem, just that it is not intuitive. Tom

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 8:20:00 PM
From: Cheeky Kid	Respond to of 2340

I think it was said before, if we keep making more changes, we'll have the Classic SI back....YES!! How about a feature to have members use, either the new site or the Classic Site?

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 8:28:00 PM
From: Cheeky Kid	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

Jeff, I asked this before, how about a POLL? A link to the poll that is on every page so all members can vote, once. Questions: Would you prefer to use the existing SI layout or the new SI site? Would you rather we added the new features to the existing SI layout or abandon it and replace it with the new site? Also have a message telling people that they will be moving to the new site and feedback is critical. I am a faithful Palm pilot user, just picked up a Palm V to replace my old one. If 3Com said they were abandoning the Palm OS for Windows CE, what do you think would happen to the user base?

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 8:33:00 PM
From: Lane3	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

I think your idea about getting rid of the bottom half of the blue bar deserves consideration. That navigation is already available at the bottom of the page. Earlier today, someone (I'd look up the message and attribute the idea but the "search this thread only" is not working yet.) suggested removing the stocktalk/hot subjects/new subjects/stocktalk search navigation. That, too, would clean up the page quite a bit and raise the message higher on the page. Those items would need to be added to the navigation menu, though. They're not all there. (Why is is that some pages aren't on the navigation menu? One would think that all options would be there.) I think the fixes made so far have been for the better. The problem has been a surfeit of disjointed stuff presented with a noisy and unsettling color scheme. SI's agreeing to subdue and coordinate the color scheme has meant a lot as has the option to add white space by shortening the message display line. And reducing the bug infestation has lowered the frustration level. I like not having to sign in every session and being able to read ten messages at a time well enough that I can work around some other things. I've never seen browse master, but it sounds like its fans will be harder to win over. Karen

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 8:41:00 PM
From: E. Davies	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

the main blue bar at the top of the screen might be too big... too heavy. Of course it is. I thought that was obvious all along and you just had not gotten around to fixing it. It is thick and most importantly it is almost completely blank. I see no need for an option at all, why would anyone prefer it the way it is? The "go" button has such great fanfare around it. Why? I was fine with doing a search on the stock symbol at the bottom of the screen. Heres my opinion: make the "Go" button and the "SI Navigation" pulldown choices that you can put in the toolbar. There are more places in the toolbar than I regularly use anyhow. Either that or put the navigation in the upper right of the screen where the Go2net link is now. "Go" could be dropped as far as I care. On a positive note: I stopped using SI beta for a week or so as I decided that the annoyances outweighed the benefits. Today I gave it a try again. For some reason I liked it a lot better than before. Did you change the colors? Some font sizes? They dont bother me like they used to. I put a frame around my box and set it to be stretchable to the screen size and found that better than SI classic (Though the toolbar does not shrink with it). My two biggest annoyances are still there: The tiny links for "new" topics in subjectmarks (Try hitting a '1'), and the fact that the "next" is also small. Someone should figure a way to make "next" a keyboard hit it is done so often. Think about my two annoyances: They are together 90-95% of the links I click within SI. SI beta has some cool features and loses some very good things too. You should be striving only to improve. I tend to agree with the people who say that completely redoing the site is a questionable decision. I think you should consider your work on the beta a "concept" experiment and return to "SI classic" and add features gradually. In this way you can take the time to debug and get feedback in small increments. I also agree that you should be focusing more on improving on your strengths rather than filling in "me too" features (which I do actually like). SI is already set apart in how well it handles messaging- make it even better. Your intentions to improve Inbox are a start, but I'd really like to see better searching capabilites (like the "this subject only" you removed) Still I have to say I'm glad to see so much effort and dilligence in improving SI. Dont give up in the face of all the complaining. Keep it simple and keep it clean and everyone will learn to like it. Eric

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 9:11:00 PM
From: Jorj X Mckie	Respond to of 2340

Jeff, Don't mean to fill your inbox, but.... Another area would be when responding to either a private message or a public message. If it is a private message that you are responding to, the "reply" button is directly over the left hand side of the test. If it is a public message it is on the right and separate from the text. If you want the site to be intuitive, at the very least they should be the same since the function is essentially the same. I would argue also that the way that you have it for private messages is the more intuitive as it is on the left and in the same are of focus as the text. Tom

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 9:23:00 PM
From: Zeuspaul	Respond to of 2340

What is it about the new SI that is bothering people? The 'new' SI is not focused on the message boards. The message boards are the heart and sole of SI. My thoughts Keep the beta but move slowly. Users have to learn to get around. SI users will help each other but we need time to learn the interface. If the change is made too quickly there will not be enough fluent users to help the others. The new site seems to be primarily a new interface..not much beef. I can work with the interface, what I want is added value. Make a significant improvement in the search capability..improve the message center..make a bookmark management page (waiting for the subject mark page to load is an exercise in watching molasses flow in January) and users will migrate to the added value. The added value should first benefit the message boards..then benefit the technical aspects of investing..charts...news..portfolios.. I agree on the second wide blue bar..add a second line of custom choices instead..SI Navigation at the bottom is enough...Put Go at the bottom. I agree with the poster that wants a bigger NEXT button. I use NEXT 100+ more times than I use Go..yet Go is more prominent. With a second line of custom navigation options the four under SI Navigation would no longer be needed. SiliconInvestor looks good in the upper left. Make it a little bigger...move A Go2Net Network Site to the bottom of the page..as a footnote and replace it with an SI logo. We are SI and like it..give the boards a little character...a nice place to hang out<g> The search for SI message boards should be prominent..separate from any other search. We are first message boards..don't hide the message board search. Keep posting and listening...Bryan too... We want to feel that management and users are in it together..isn't that how you built SI? Zeuspaul

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 9:28:00 PM
From: E. Davies	Respond to of 2340

I'd like to follow up on my last post with a little repeat for emphasis: Take what everyone likes and add that first. Make SI about constant improvement not rework. Focus on the strengths. Best example of that is the "view 10". Who doesnt like that? Add that to SI and let people get excited about the change. After all reading posts is 95% of what we do. But think how much drastically better it could be! I'm sure you have looked at Browsemaster. Except for the fact it is buggy I cant find anything bad about the interface. View all in a thread, view all messages, respond and view responses from a multi-message window, .... Start looking for what people want, not what they dont like! Lets hear what people LIKE about SI and SI beta! What will it take to like it even more? Eric

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/18/1999 9:31:00 PM
From: Jorj X Mckie	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

Sorry, one more I just noticed that the "reply" button isn't always directly over the text for private messages. The position of the left margin can change depending on the width of the text, thus changing the relative position of the "reply" button and the text. Again, the fact that the left margin of the text can change ruins any intuitive feel of the user interface. And the positional change in relation to the navigation commands further compounds the issue.

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/19/1999 8:09:00 AM
From: Caroline	Respond to of 2340

Jeff, the only real way to answer your query is for you guys to post a beta-beta so we can try it. Caroline

To: Jeff Dryer who wrote (681)	7/19/1999 3:44:00 PM
From: Paul K	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 2340

I agree 100% with removal of the "GO/SI Navigation" components in the header. 1. You have duplication of the functions on the bottom of every page now. 2. we can't seem to agree on the color scheme :)